Official Drone Talk Thread: Deals, advice, cameras, flying tips & more

@garyhgaryh Any crashes yet? I'm glad I bought prop guards, or else I would have chewed up a few props already! Any luck on getting the FPV set up and running?

@twall I, luckily, have not crashed yet. However, on my first flight with my gopro attached, the phantom tipped over during lift off. I would have done some damaged to the blades so the propeller guards are a must have. People say they make the drone less stable, but it seems fine for me. I've actually have landed the drone without crashing or tipping over so I think my phantom is easy to control.

@thismyusername the happy go lucky sound track makes that less painful to watch. "Let Mikey go in there to retrieve the quad, he'll go anywhere!"

@dashcloud I love you!

I flew my Phantom 2 for the first time just this morning and.... cashed it. Broke the gimbal mount and scuffed up my purty play toy. So now I need to hunt around for resources on how to fix it; and your link was an excellent first step. Thanks!

Oh, and for those who are curious, I forgot to calibrate the compass before I took off AND was showing off for some people that had gathered to watch AND I got my throttle/directional controls momentarily confused and flew the thing into a tree branch about 30 feet off the ground. :( But it was fuuuuuun!!!!

@pepsiwine Praise Irk!

@pepsiwine No serious damage then? Didja have a camera mounted to preserve the memory for posterity?

@ruouttaurmind Broke a prop, scuffed up the body, popped out the battery, cracked the battery case, dented the GoPro, broke the gimbal mount completely off the Phantom mount.

Video was running during the whole thing, but when I went to pull it off the camera it was corrupted. It took a bit of doing, but I ended up retrieving about 4 minutes of the flight. Weirdly enough the retrievable portion of video ended just a few seconds before I crashed - it's like the GoPro got a concussion during the crash and ended up with retrograde amnesia. :)

But what video it DID take was pretty cool. Gonna buy some replacement parts and go at it again soon.

@pepsiwine Looking forward to seeing the vid!

@duodec I told my wife I won't get into any more hobbies and I get into this one. She said I've been obsessed with this new drone... She's right!

@garyhgaryh @doudec I have the strategy for convincing my spouse ("I can fund it by doing flyovers for our Realtor friends"). But now have to cut through model/accessory analysis paralysis.

@ruouttaurmind I installed the Assistant first because I didn't know what an MC was. I actually tried to install the driver first, then answered 'No' and installed the Assistance software. MC is master controller (correct me if I am wrong) - the remote. I had guest tonight and now my daughter is asleep in the office so I won't be able to continue tonight :(. Thanks for the info bud! I feel like we're all a family here helping each other out...

@ruouttaurmind Ok, my daughter is up so I went ahead and connected my Phanto to the computer. The firmware version IS NOT in the tools tab. It's under the Upgrade tab. I seem to have all the updates and no IMU calibration was necessary. I'm going to install the stock blade, the blade guard, and the new taller landing gear.

@garyhgaryh Looks like I did it right -

@garyhgaryh That is a feature of DJI transmitters. They do throttle a bit differently than your average RC aircraft. You may also have noticed the throttle stick is sprung. Most RC TX don't do this. Throttle stays wherever you leave it. Left-Right position is usually sprung, but up-down is not on a standard TX. The Phantom operates in "relative" throttle mode. Center throttle there is another detent. That's your normal operating position. When you take off, find your altitued and let go of the throttle, the stick returns to center position and the Phantom (theoretically) keeps that altitude. When you want to decrease your altitude, push down on the throttle. When you've acheived the altitude you want, release the throttle and the stick will center itself again. It's a logical system, and I can't say I dislike it. It's different, but I see the merit. Unfortunately for anyone who's first multi is a DJI, and they learn that system, switching to another brand can be problematic.

@ruouttaurmind thanks bud! My drone is quiet. The blades seem well balanced. Seems like a hight quality product. Will post more pics and video(s) later.

@crapstick I tried my Lectron 2700mah and it was a bit of a snug fit. I had to squeeze the battery door closed. Only a couple mm off, but I don't think I want to chance having the battery door pop open in flight and have the battery slip out. I may conisder an extended battery door so I can use the Black Magic 3000mah lipos.

@ruouttaurmind Mine is also a tight fit but I am able to gently wiggle the orange battery connector and all the excess wire to fit into the slot above the battery and the door closes normally without any resistance.

@crapstick what amperage you guys charging your batteries at and why? I'm charging at 1amp to prolong the battery life.

@garyhgaryh I have only charged them a few times so far. I just use 3 amps. As long as it doesn't catch on fire, or break or something, I just dont care if I shorten my battery life a bit. I'm not the type to baby my electronics. They work for me!

@crapstick Thanks! Good take on having electronics work for you. I baby my shit! lol.

@garyhgaryh 1C is a relatively low-stress charge rate, so 2A with the stock charger and stock battery should be fine. I do sometimes charge at 1A on your theory about babying the batteries.

@garyhgaryh 3A. Batteries can be replaced, but flight time lost, waiting for a charge isn't. :-)

@crapstick lots of complaints of non-DJI batteries "puffing" over time (and ultimately not fitting). Keep us posted.

@ruouttaurmind I never bring a charger with me on the day of the flight. I'll charge em before the flight so I have 6 batteries on hand. Will continue charging at 1A until I need it quickly, then I'll charge it at 2 or 3A :). I got 4 turnigy batteries and two phantom batteries. I'm waiting for the multistar 4A batteries to restock at Hobby King and I'll buy a few of those for testing.

@geezfools It definitely hovers better than my CX-20. Much smoother. But I'm not overwhelmed by it's GPS Hold. I put it in hold and it wanders around in about a 12 foot circle. The CX-20 is twitchy as hell, but holds position within about three feet. The Tali... well, it's three times the price for a reason I guess. GPS Hold is smooth as butter and only wanders a foot or two. That's what six big motors and beasty 9 inch rotors will do for you I guess.

@ruouttaurmind I flew mine earlier today and I did noticed that it would keep itself in a 10-12 foot circle in a somewhat windy day here in CA. I thought my GPS wasn't working...

@ruouttaurmind I think circular wandering happens when the compass isn't calibrated.

@zippyus Thanks for the suggestion, but I've been through the calibration a couple of times, with no difference. Maybe I'll try a different park and see if maybe there's some kind of interference that only seems to affect the Phantom.

@ruouttaurmind late reply but could also be a magnetized compass. There are videos for how to demag them.

@zippyus I appreciate your reply. Since the original posting I've learned quite a bit about what I'm experiencing. It's called TBE (toilet bowl effect) and it's pretty common from what I've been reading.

@ruouttaurmind Awesome! Subscribed!

@brhfl Just one...

@ruouttaurmind …okay, that is impressive.

@brhfl How about this one?

@garyhgaryh 3.3 volts seems to be the value mentioned most. I got a couple - my plan is to test it to "failure" just hovering in my yard and see what actually happens at alarm time......

@ruouttaurmind I got my anti-vibration mount yesterday and am debating on whether to mount it since I'll get my gimbal in a few days!

@sportykev Here's a Chinese 3D for about $115 with free shippping http://www.banggood.com/GL-3X-3-Axis-CNC-Brushless-Gimbal-FPV-for-Gopro33-Phantom-1-2-p-957754.html And the Walkera G-3D for $170: http://www.banggood.com/Walkera-G-3D-3-Axis-Camera-Gimbal-For-iLook-iLook-GoPro3-GoPro3-p-934833.html

@ruouttaurmind this is you recommending these or google recommending these??? I fail to see what makes these Chinese gimbals worth more than any others...
I'm starting with 2-D - I got this one on eBay for under $50 - and it includes the required controller.... From what I can see using the 3-D gimbals means losing landing legs. I'll prolly save that for my "next" drone.....
http://www.ebay.com/itm/DJI-Phantom-RTF-CNC-ALU-Brushless-Gimbal-Camera-w-2-Motor-Controller-Gopro-3-3-/121562493193?ssPageName=ADME:L:OC:US:3160

@Pufferfishy I have the Walkera 3D gimbal on my Tali H500 and it works very well. Maybe not as well as a Zenmuse? I can't say since I don't have a Zenmuse. But I have no complaints about the one I am using. It's smooth, quick and very well built and it includes the controller and a host of interface ports for half the price of a Zenmuse..

@ruouttaurmind Thanks. Can you speak to the "interference" of the legs on the Phantom? I bought a set of wide/tall legs for the 2-D gimbal, but I saw a few posts mentioning interference with the 3rd axis.
I plan to do a lot of lurking on RC forums, and I suppose I should get some seat-time with the 2-D before asking a ton of questions, but I welcome first-hand experience here.
Do you find that the 3rd axis is really something you like having -vs- just rotating the drone?

@Pufferfishy By the way, I assumed you are talking about doing this on a Phantom? If you're looking for yaw/pan control of a 3D gimbal, there are several things you'll have to change. The Phantom TX doesn't have an available switch or channel to control gimbal yaw. You'd have to change your TX and radio to add more channels. You'd also have to have retractable landing gear, or they will always be in your shot. If the gear is long enough to keep the camera/gimbal off the ground, they'll be right in LOS as you rotate your pan control. So retractable gear would be required. The basic Zenmuse 3D isn't really designed for panning, it just ads a third dimension of stabilization. And frankly, it does a good job at that, but I can't say it's worth the extra $100 to $130 to add a 3D over a cheap Chinese 2D unless you're planning on doing some professional work. Here's an example of the Tali with retracts and the 3D gimbal.

@ruouttaurmind That's a super-sweet set-up. Eventually I hope to be in that class of copter, but not for a while. The 2-D will work for me fine I think.
I was drooping over the Inspire1 and Phantom3 - each seem pretty impressive in their class.

@WilhelmScreamer MAN that looks fun. I want to build me one of those 250s...

@StanLube DJI offers a Ground Station software for creating autonomous missions with your Phantom. There is a PC version and a iOS version. I haven't yet figured out how to use PC Ground Station with a USB connection to the Phantom. It seems this may not be possible, and may require their DataLink module. The iOS version uses Bluetooth to communicate with the Phantom, but at a minimum this requires the DJI BTU module. To install this in a Phantom 1 requires a host of upgrades. As far as FPV, using DJI equipment to accomplish this would, again, require upgrades to your Phantom. As an alternative, you can add a simple 5.8ghz transmitter with a GoPro interface cable for under $30. You also need a receiver/monitor. You can do this with a separate receiver and monitor, or a monitor with integrated receiver. However you go, expect to spend between $100 to $150 for a non-DJI solution. Adding the DJI upgrades and using all DJI technology to do FPV will run you in the neighborhood of $300-$500.

@Pufferfishy Compatible batteries with the correct XT60 connector are very plentiful for about the same price you lilsted. Be very aware of the dimensions, as different manufacturers have identical MAH rating batteries in a variety of sizes. Just make sure it's LiPo, 3C, 11.1v and at least 20c with a XT60 connector, and the physical dimensions will fit within the Phantom, and you're golden. Obviously if you're adding an external battery mount, dimensions are unimportant.

@ruouttaurmind Thanks! I looked at the external mounts - and saw a bunch of posts on battery-related fires, as well as folks saying that, at the end of the day, they were only seeing like 3 more minutes of flying time (added weight I suppose).
Is the fire thing that serious, or just cheap kits / user error? (I am decidedly no stranger to a soldering iron).
Any experience with added flying time the extra/external battery offers?

@Pufferfishy you can get the Zippy 2200 mah battery for $10. I bought two and it works great. I have the 2800 mah version coming next week. Will let u guys know if it fits. It has all the right connectors too!

@garyhgaryh Sadly I leapt and bought 2 "gen u wine" DJI batteries for a rather staggering sum.

Saw far too many comments from folks with generics and "puffing" when charging. The Chinese battery market is LOADED with garbage, and I didn't see a single aftermarket battery that I felt good about at the time - so this will do me well for now.
It's likely that those with puffed batteries tried to charge them at too high a rate - but regardless, a battery sold as a 30c should be able to take a 3A charge rate and not flame out.

@Pufferfishy I have two "gen u wine" DJI batteries and two Zippy batteries. I'll let you know how they do in a few months. As you know I charge all my batteries at 1A. I have a zippy 2800 coming and will order a multistar 4000 when they come back in stock. I'll give you updates of those as well. With all the batteries, I'm getting 9-12 minutes of flight time with a gopro attached with the propeller guards. I'm pretty happy with the times. I haven't put the 9443 propellers on but it would increase flight times from what i undestand.

@Pufferfishy My OEM and $10 batteries. Some of the fires are caused by people shoving in the batteries and causing shorts or punctures to the batteries. I flew today and the $10 lasted about 10-12 minutes. about the same as OEM.

@Pufferfishy I looked into this just in case I lose my phantom. This would work: http://www.amazon.com/SainSpeed-Rechargeable-Real-Time-Anti-theft-Capabilty/dp/B00CXMRGN2/ref=cm_cd_al_qh_dp_t

@garyhgaryh So these huge magnets aren't an issue??

@Pufferfishy I didn't realize they come with magnets. I would remove them if possible. I'm debating whether or not to buy this. The price is not an issue, but the subscription to another cell service is, but I don't see anyway around it if you want to be able to text your drone where you're at.

@garyhgaryh What I read in comments, there are plans you can get for $2/day ($10 SIM card cost) - but you are only billed when the device is used. So in theory I think that means only when you call it to get its location.
More investigation on various forums likely a good idea. But this seems like a cool solution.....

@Pufferfishy H20 wireless has a $100 annual plan that includes voice. I currently have H20 for my iPhone and it works great. I might go with that.. So are you going to buy this? I'm debating (not sure if there are any other solutions out there).

@Pufferfishy Here's another option:

@Pufferfishy I realize I have unlimited Tmobile data plan for life on one of my chromebooks. I will take that sim and try it out on the GPS tracker. If this works, then for a one time fee of $25 to acquire the gps tracker, I will have free gps tracking, but I'll have to take the sim card out of my chromebook. If i ever lose that sim card, I'll not be able to get free data service again if someone steals the phantom after it crashes (that's the only risk).

@garyhgaryh EVENTUALLY I will do something to try and mitigate loss - be it a "dog tag" or something more like these GPS solutions I don't know.
This is literally my "first week" of enthusiasm over quads, so in my case I think a bit of forum lurking is in order. While the temptation is great to just get the Phantom in the air, my gimbal and some spare parts are coming from China, so I have some time to educate myself a little more with others' experiences....

@garyhgaryh The GPS tracker weighs a hefty 355g. That as much as FOUR GoPro H3's. Even if the Phantom could heft the payload, it would run like a dumptruck.

@ruouttaurmind I believe the weight is shipping weight and it includes two batteries, two back doors (one with and without the magnets), and power adapter. I think I will order it for $23.33. I'll let you know how it works :). I can always repurpose the device when I'm not flying and give it to my wife when she's shopping while I take off and shop for my stuff and I can just track her when I"m done (or vise versa).

@Pufferfishy I ordered the gps tracker and will let you guys know how it works and how heavy it is.

@garyhgaryh Just visited the manufacurer's website, and you are correct. Their spec sheet says 50g (weight without the battery?). Not bad.

@ruouttaurmind For permanent mounts I am sure the case can be cut away to reduce that by half. Would be nice to find a way to tap on-board power as well.....

@Pufferfishy I thought about the two things you mention last night. U don't want to run it with the phantom battery. What if u ran into a low battery situation and it lands and shuts down? It has to have its own battery else you won't be able to track it if the phantom shuts down or runs out of juice.

@Pufferfishy there is a $10 for three months plan with T-Mobile and h2o. That's the way to go. $40/year is not bad at all. Under 11 cents/day.

@garyhgaryh Ah - did not think about the battery drain - that makes sense.
$40 isn't really bad - but I have a habit of turning my back on hobbies rather qui....

SQUIRREL!!

@Pufferfishy I have the same issues with my hobbies... I hope it's not something I abandon in three months. My friend is offering a vision 2+ (he says brand new since he has two). They go for about $1200.. Not sure how much he's asking, but if he throws out a price of $700 should I take it?

@garyhgaryh Someone just ditched like 4 of them (on the "original" sale thread) for super cheap. I think that $700 for new is pretty good for a P2 Vision+

@garyhgaryh I thought the same thing. Sell the NAZA, TX and charger on eBay and keep the battery, rotors, motors, chassis, ESC's etc. as spares. I have a buddy that does pretty awesome airbrush work, I'd love to turn over the chassis shell to him and see what he can do with it.

@ruouttaurmind Wow - that's really not a bad idea.
I don't know anyone skilled with an airbrush, but I've got Sharpies and glitter....

@Pufferfishy Meh can start a new web series called "Pimp My Flight". LOL!

@ruouttaurmind Well, I forgot that meh.com is on east coast time so I can't buy another one cuz the deal is over. oh well. Good for me as I saved $305!

@ruouttaurmind Hey can you take some pics for us? I don't like how my videos are turning out without a gimbal so I'm excited to get mine. If you have time, make a video but pictures will do.

@garyhgaryh You betcha!

@ruouttaurmind be sure to use another "not quite Satriani" audio track - even if you're digging ditches at least you have a rocking soundtrack

@ruouttaurmind ...not that "Ride of the Valkyries" was that bad..... just it's been done....

@Pufferfishy Rockin' soundtrack. Check.

@garyhgaryh Dammit if I didn't take off early from work and rush to the post office. Got there at 4:35... only to discover they close at 4:30. Well, I'll hit 'em up on the way to work in the morning.

@ruouttaurmind Can ya link which/where you got your gimbal? I'm starting to find a lot of 3-axis Chinese jammies on eBay for under 100, tempted to try...

@sportykev I picked up this one from eBay. The least expensive ones can be had for about $40 but I paid a bit more for the "skeletonized" version that weighs about 30% less. Took just under 2 weeks to arrive from China. http://www.ebay.com/itm/271602466071

@ruouttaurmind I a very disappointed at you! lol... ok, give us pics tomorrow!

@ruouttaurmind sweet thanks, let us know how it goes. The $80 3-axis i was looking at, realized it didn't include controller board >.>

@thismyusername OMG dude - that is EPIC. You got a viral vid right there!!! (or is that not you?)

@Pufferfishy not me... he ran like the wind for a save!

@Pufferfishy Not unless he's in Australia, mate!

@thismyusername oh well - still, an awesome vid. I didn't look at it on YouTube - I suppose that would have clued me to location....

@thismyusername That's nice. I flew my drone today and for the first time it landed by itself because the battery went low. I'm glad the return to home feature works on my drone. I wonder if that guy ran out of juice?! Doesn't look like it landed home though.

@Pufferfishy Definitely showed some hustle there, didn't he? :-)

@garyhgaryh Seems that the case... the emergency low battery mode perhaps.

@thismyusername Yes, that was exactly how my drone acted when it was low. Question I have is why didn't it go home or perhaps it was going home.

@garyhgaryh (puts on internet conspiracy hat) I bet he launched it from hand right there planning this all for the exposure! (some of the discussions are talking about an emergency low batt condition or malfunction that just sits itself down where it is at asap.... no idea if its real on the model he is using etc, I bet someone has an article with him soon since the video went viral.)

@thismyusername IIRC, Phantom will TRY to get home, but if it reaches the second voltage threshold it will land immediately.

@thismyusername I love this video, and watched it about 10 times last night. i still have a hunch that it is faked, with possibly a second pilot hidden somewhere because of the video shot, but still, it looks great and was done really well.

@ruouttaurmind damn look at the dude's nails! Worse than mine lol.

@Pufferfishy lol... you have a url for that? Water is heavy!

@garyhgaryh There's also a bubble maker, a missle launcher and a hoist from the same maker. Here's a rundown: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1805425

@garyhgaryh Yeah - that's the stuff. I don't think it holds more than one blast, but it could be entertaining....

@Pufferfishy Under $7 and free shipping on eBay http://www.ebay.com/itm/381147386889

@Pufferfishy @ruouttaurmind OMG it's like the internet read my mind!! I was out flying my Phantom 2 in the backyard this weekend and a squirrel was up in a tree chittering at me so I told the bf that I wished they made squirt guns you could attach to your drone so I could shoot the squirrels with it!
Too funny!

@garyhgaryh Looks pretty well done, innit. Prolly weighs a bit less than my aluminum ones.

@ruouttaurmind do you think these plates will fit on your gimbal?

@garyhgaryh I'll take a center-to-center measurement and post here. When you have a minute, if I could impose upon you to check the dims on that I'd be very greatful!

@ruouttaurmind It's 2 3/8 from center to center between the mounting holes. Diagonally, it's 3 3/8 in.

@garyhgaryh It occurs to me after messing with mine... the dims of your kit don't matter all that much as long as you can move the components from the gimbal over to it. The gimbal has a single bracket that attaches to the plate with two screws. Then the controller board mounts with some nylon standoffs on each of the four corners. So you'll have to drill 6 holes in the CF plate. Four for mounting the controller and two for mounting the bracket that supports the rest of the gimbal. Pics to follow...

@garyhgaryh This pic shows the support that connects with the anti-jello mount. It's a single bracket mounted at a 90* angle to the jello mount. Secured with two screws through the jello mount into the end of the bracket. This is the only mechanical connection between the anti-jello mount and the rest of the gimbal.

@garyhgaryh This shows how the controller board is mounted to the anti-jello mount with nylon standoffs. The controller board is sort of sandwiched between the two layers of the anti-jello plates. That's it. Everything else is an electrical connection. No soldering should be necessary, Drill a few holes at the right location and Bob's your uncle.

@ruouttaurmind Thanks. I'm not sure there's enough surface area to drill the holes in my CF mount. It's very sparse in the surface area dept.

@garyhgaryh Glue it in place with stand-offs and silicone?

@ruouttaurmind Nice! I thought it was going to be silver :). When ya going to install it?

@garyhgaryh I really wanted the purple one... thought I ordered silver, but black will do just fine. :-) I'll be installing on the CX-20 about ten seconds after I get home tonight. Well, maybe five minutes and ten seconds 'cause the dogs prolly wanna go outside first. The CX-20 has all the necessary connections readily available, plus pitch and roll dial controls on the TX.

@ruouttaurmind did it come with "drop retention pins"? I just ordered a pack. I will be using at least 2 wire ties so my "bird" doesn't drop a $300 egg from 200 feet....

@ruouttaurmind I bought purple - but it's not the "skeletal" one like this. I plan to swap the plates with CF units I got.

@Pufferfishy It didn't come with the retention pins. On my other ones I use dental floss. I tie a loop of floss around each of the four damper balls. Funny, right? But floss is strong as hell and contributes no measurable weight to the aircraft. Four loops of floss, a surgeon's knot and done. Plus, it gives the gimbal a sweet minty taste.

@ruouttaurmind Floss is rather ingenious - and I get like 400 yards of it every time I get my teefs cleaned, so I like the idea.

@ruouttaurmind I watched this when I was trying to find a 5.8 system.. Too bad they don't have the boscam 600mw product to review.

@ruouttaurmind eeesh - this guy makes some great videos but holy crap he could cut 30% of the screen time from every one of them.

@ruouttaurmind Nice! Thank you for the video. Thumbs up for the video!

@ruouttaurmind looks very gimbally!

@ruouttaurmind can ya link to which gimbal that is? how do you like the build quality?

@sportykev Here's the one I bought, but several eBay and Amazon sellers have them for about the same price. www.ebay.com/itm/271602466071

@ruouttaurmind Got home from work and just couldn't wait to get my hands dirty finishing up the gimbal install. I shortened the power cable, installed a female JST connector on it, moved the gimbal back a bit so it was more towards COG, then connected the servo controls for pitch and roll, then cleaned up the wire routing for a cleaner look and less chance of interference. Build quality seems very good. The metal anodizing (paint?) isnt' the best I've seen, but the circuit assy is first rate and all the components seem good. Front... Right side... Left side... Back... Finally, a quick video demonstrating pitch and roll controlled by the AUX1 and AUX2 pots on the TX. I can't imagine any reason why I'd want to control roll, but the channel was empty, so for now it's functional: :

Just did a quick test flight around the back yard. Wow. I got the COG just right. It hovers perfectly, but DAMN did it ever gain some weight! I really had to pour on the throttle to get enough lift to take off. I have no doubt this is really going to hit my flight time hard.

@ruouttaurmind I have so many gimbals sitting in my eBay cart right now LOL. Torn between 3axis, but they are so much pricier, and I guess I could always yaw gently! OK I just convinced myself, narrow down to 2D!

@sportykev 3d gimbal with controller for $138 http://www.ebay.com/itm/131328244714

@garyhgaryh doesn't seem bad at all. Your props must be nicely in balance.

@garyhgaryh Well done! IIRC, you're using some flavor of GoPro?

@Pufferfishy Yeah I think my props are balanced well. When I first started the drone I was impressed how there was no noticeable vibration.

@ruouttaurmind Yes, I have a GoPro Hero (the old one). I want to upgrade my gopro as it's been 2-3 years old.

@Pufferfishy For those still sold on the 3+ Black there are "factory reconditioned" units on eBay for the same price, but be advised that the only accessory they include at that price is the WiFi remote.
The 3+ Black is "no longer in production" - because the base 4 is basically the same camera plus bluetooth. For a lot more green.
Am I the only one that thinks these things are way over-priced??

@Pufferfishy That's why I'm using a Vivitar I got at Walmart for thirty five bucks! LOL!

@Pufferfishy Have you put hands on a S71? I'm curious how the size compares to GoPro. In the pics it looks like a pretty stout package, innit? I like the idea of 4K, but at 12fps I can't see much use for it, though the S71 will do 1080p@60 which is great for post options (slow-mo, ff, etc.). At a modest 59g including battery I don't think weight will be a problem. And I like the 10fps burst 16mp still mode too.

@ruouttaurmind I don't know how much of a judge I can be as I've never owned a GoPro - but I will say that once the LCD is off (a feature I REALLY like) to me it looks smaller.
In fact - I think on at least one of the eleventy-billion comparo sites I looked at at 11:45pm last night they did a physical comparo and the S71 WAS smaller when the LCD was removed.

@Pufferfishy They are overpriced (the gopro's). Didya know the Gopro CEO is one of the highest paid/compensated CEO today?

@Pufferfishy You can get some goo deals on cameras. I bought my Gopro Hero, contour roam, and roam plus for $99/ea. I watched for sales and clearances. I recently picked up a Sony HDR-AS200 for $149 because of the stabilization. The coutour and the AS200 is a cylinder so most gimbals won't readily attached to them unless you get creative. I also bought two Garmin VIRB cameras when they went on clearance for $99. I wanted them because they can be linked together. So if I have two of them on my bike, turning on one will turn both on and vise versa. I want a Gopro Hero 3 black edition but don't want to pay alot for it.

@garyhgaryh Will the two VIRB's work together to make 3D vid like the GoPro 3D kit? I'd love to do some 3D flights.

@ruouttaurmind I actually have my cameras mounted in the front and back of the bike so I can get two views. If I turn the front camera off my back one goes off too. I usually run a contour up front and gopro in the back and i hate it that i have to shut both cameras off when I take a break. With the VIRBs they are linked together so I no longer need to worry about operating both cameras.

@ruouttaurmind I was also looking at the Polaroid CUBE - you can easily slap 2 of them side-by-side on a standard gimbal - and I'm sure stitching the video to make 3D would not be hard in Photoshop or some post-process software. It think it's simply all about getting the camera apertures at a distance apart that approximates the average pupilary distance of humanz.

@ruouttaurmind I know that my hand doesn't offer anything in the way of scale - but sans LCD this thing is pretty tiny..... (FWIW - I can "palm" a basketball)
I don't have anything that measure in metric handy - so these are approx. conversion from Empirical measure:
Depth: 23.8mm
Length: 58.74mm
Height: 42.86mm
Weight with battery, no LCD: 85g




I sorta had the poop scared out of me when I first took it out of the WAY-TOO-COMPLICATED(fuck_you_landfil) packaging - I thought it had a huge aberration on the lens..


I think I just got a bonus Chinese booger.....

It's interesting to note that page 14 of the manual says you can charge it with the INCLUDED power adapter - but there's no power adapter included..... Currently charging via USB....

@Pufferfishy I will know for sure when it gets here - but I THINK that screw-on lens filters kits for the GoPro will also work here (they come with a frame that uses set-screws to attach, then a standard 37mm or 52mm filter can be screwed on that). I have a 52mm circular polarizer coming.....
Fingers crossed (but it was like $7)

@Pufferfishy Just a bit off from the H3 dims. H3 is 59mmx41mmx21mm. So it won't fit in a H3 frame, but shouldn't be a problem on the Chinese gimbals.

@Pufferfishy How do you like the camera? does it get warm after 15 mins if you're shooting at 4k?

@Pufferfishy What type of battery does this camera use?

@garyhgaryh The odds of me shooting 15 minutes of 4k are slim to none - I have nothing that will display the resolution.

@Pufferfishy Thanks.. I have a 4k monitor for my computer, but it's refresh rate is 15 fps. I'm debating either the hero 4 black or the s71 that you bought. Do you have any footage of the s71 uploaded to any sites? I assume u just got it.

@garyhgaryh working on it - not seeing my SD card. I hope to god Amazon didn't "pair" it with something unsupported. Stay tuned.

@garyhgaryh Rather than let YouTube process it I figured I'd post a "raw" test shot.
This is literally "put in battery, put in SD card, set for 4k, and shoot". I have tweaked nothing

This is my first "action cam" - I assume the spherical aberration is expected? I don't see an adjustment for "zoom level" readily apparent...

2:20 / 252MB of me walking around my back yard (it's shaky the most when I have to watch the ground for lawn sausages from my dog). Tried to get a mix of bright light and shade.

Seems like it did pretty well to me....

And even at this short of a movie it did get warm - so I'm guessing a 10 minute go is going to have it cooking.

Rather a PITA that the device does not "mount" when attached to a computer - I had to pull the SD card. Does the GoPro do that too? That's one thing I never considered, albeit a minor inconvenience....

Moderate to severe lens flare from the sun.
I can see where UV/Polarizers are going to help a lot with this cam.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/oopic2vwkyai05b/First_4k_Test.mp4?dl=0

@Pufferfishy BTW - the battery is a proprietary format. Have not looked for generics. Note that the spot normally occupied by the LCD can also be filled with a secondary battery / memory unit (called a "backup pack" for reasons as of yet unbeknownst to me)

@Pufferfishy Vivitar DS-S50 battery - half the price ($12.50) of the AEE units.

@Pufferfishy I viewed the raw movie file and it's surprisingly sharp, however it's a bit jittery, but it's at 15fps so that's probably why. It could also be my monitor since it's refresh rate is also 15fps. Could you take a 2 minute clip at 1080p and at 2.7k (at least 30fps)? I'd like to see how the movies look at that resolution. With my gopro i take out the sdcard, although it also works when connected via usb port.

@garyhgaryh 15fps IS going to look jittery. I will get a couple more samples - but my weekends are super-busy. I would say that if 4K is a hard requirement you need the GoPro 4+

@Pufferfishy Just got to download your vid. Florida? I have to say, the quality of the image is great. Good color, good contrast, it seems to do a pretty good job between shadows and bright sunlight. Nice! I think the 15fps is a bit unsettling, but if the image looks as good @1080p, you've got a pretty fantastic camera there.

@ruouttaurmind Yes - I'm just outside Clearwater.

Here's 2 more tests - 2.7k@30fps and 1040p@48fps.
IMO even at 30fps the 2.7k still looks to have some jitter, that sort of leads me to believe it's not 30fps. But also note - I'm something of a shaky old bastard, especially after a morning of coffee and yardwork.

Color, contrast, and saturation remain quite excellent - the latter maybe even a bit over the top. But you can see in my lawn where I have "light spots" (sadly showing where I am probably growing spring fungus).

I also note that the focus did not seem to be as tight at 2.7k - I don't know that 1 short vid is enough to make a jusdgement, but my eyes are pretty attuned to "things photographic" and that soft focus on the close-ups of the passion flowers caught my attention immediately.

~171MB for 1:34 pf 2.7k@30 https://www.dropbox.com/s/sgeeacmeviw5rle/2.7k_30fps.mp4?dl=0

~295MB for 1:22 of 1080p@48 https://www.dropbox.com/s/tahv6udjsf9h9gt/1080p_48fps.mp4?dl=0

@Pufferfishy VideoLAN says it is, in fact, 29.97FPS and shows no dropped frames. Mabe it is just "shaky me".

@Pufferfishy Also - the 1080p vid where I walk into the sun shows CLEARLY that these things should be coming with a lens hood. I have that filter adapter coming - just need to see if it fits then find me a light 52mm rubber boot

@Pufferfishy Well, thanks for the HD link. Right before I left this AM I ordered it. I paid a tad under $247.00.

@Pufferfishy Thanks for the last two uploads. I finally viewed them. It's so jittery, but I think it must be you, not the camera! :) I still feel comfy enough to get it.. I will test both the new camera and the hero HD in 1080 and 720 format when I get the s71.

@garyhgaryh My stock Phantom battery gives around 10-11 min. of agressive flight time on the Phantom. The CX-20 gives about 13 min. on it's stock 2700mah bat. I haven't tried it with the gimbal yet, but I'm guessing that time will drop significantly. The kit (gimbal and camera) adds quite a bit of weight.

@ruouttaurmind Thanks!

@garyhgaryh That's the original Hero you have now, right? A hundy might be tough. They're $129 on the GoPro website brand new.

@ruouttaurmind Here's my ad on my fb page (trying to sell it to friends before putting it out publicly: I'm selling my gopro hero for $100 (over $300 invested) with three batteries, extra 3rd party charger, underwater case, and various attachments. Includes the optional extended battery attachment with different doors for the underwater case (that itself is $60). Anyone interested before I put it up for sale publicly (ebay/craigs)? I have all the original packaging. I am missing the back battery panel, but I can probably find it (i use the extended battery pack so it's not needed).

@garyhgaryh Ya, that's quite a bit of kit and surely worth the ask.

@ruouttaurmind I got five people on my fb page that want to buy it so it's sold. However, the sale ended on the hero 4. I think I may look at the S71 that puffy bought.

@garyhgaryh I want to stick with the GP size format, but the S71 looks like a damn fine camera!

@ruouttaurmind I looked at puffy's video. It's sharp, but 4k it's a bit jittery at 15fps. Could be my monitor as well since the refresh rate is slow. I'd like to see some samples at 1080p and at 2.7k (at least 30fps). I'll ask him.

@ruouttaurmind Definitely looked like it was doing a good job of fighting the roll.

@ruouttaurmind Thanks for the video! The image is definitely stable - I can't wait to get mine. Did you notice an increase drain in the battery due to the gimbal or was it not noticeable? When you say roll servo are you talking about the pitch control? Thanks!

@garyhgaryh @Pufferfishy I think I might go a different direction. I'm considering listing my three day old gimbal on eBay and picking up one of the plastic ones from Walkera. They are a modest 120g.

@garyhgaryh RE: Roll control... my TX has a couple of spare channels controlled by pots at the top of the control panel designed for servo control. I connected them to the pitch and the roll controls of the gimbal. Pitch is a useful thing to have access to. Roll? Not so much. I saw about 2 minutes less flight time. But... since it was a windy day I can't attribute all that to the added weight. I'll have to wait for a calm day and see what the effect on battery life is.

@ruouttaurmind I'm still waiting for my aluminum gimbal - I will swap the 2 main plates with the CF units I have and see what the diff is.

I'm also guessing that EVERY mfg. lies about the weight - the AEE camera already weighed in 20+g over what the spec for camera and battery were stated to be.
And I'm really not going to go nuts on this quad - I'm waiting until I get one big enough to fly my D600 around :)

@Pufferfishy I weighed out the 160g gimbal before installing it. It really does weigh 160g wtihout the mounting plate. I looked into retrofitting my gimbal to CF. It will cost more than it's worth and won't save as much weight as I had hoped. So I'm going to try the plastic one and see how it goes. Another thing I really like about the Walkera gimbals is the QD mounting system. There's a rail that attaches to the chassis of the craft and the gimbal has a slot the rail slides into, with a lock screw that holds it all in place. Makes it a breeze to remove the gimbal in about 30 seconds. This is a small image, but you can see how it goes together here. Perhaps I'll try the 3d gimbal from the Tali first to make sure everything fits well.

Here's a front view of the 3d gimbal with the rail mounting system

@ruouttaurmind The reason why you're thinking about going another route is due to the weight of the gimbal? Or was there some other reason? I have CF plates from the anti-jello isolator I bought. Will see if it fits. If it does, then you can buy that isolator for $6 for a cheap fix.

@garyhgaryh Couple reasons: 1. WEIGHT! The gimbal and camera add 240g (a bit over half a pound) and it definitely affects the flight characteristics. 2. I like the Walkera's quick-detach system. It would be nice to be able to easily remove the gimbal for transport, or to quickly move it to another quad without having to disassemble everything. 3. The physical size obstructs access to the output ports on the bottom of the CX-20. Mini USB, two 12v supply and two RX-AUX ports are on the bottom and the plate covers half the port hatch, obstructing access to one of the 12v ports and a AUX channel. But weight is the biggest issue. With the gimbal attached the CX-20 won't hold it's altitude in GPS mode.

@ruouttaurmind How much does that vivitar camera weigh? It looks heavy. The reasons stated is enough for me to upgrade esp if it's blocking ports and not holding altitude. Why don't you put that gimbal on the phantom?

@ruouttaurmind My gimbal has arrived at the post office. Should get it most likely tuesday! Yeah: April 25, 2015 , 4:08 pm Arrived at USPS Facility SAN FRANCISCO, CA 94128

Vivitar is pretty svelt. Fits in the palm of my hand and weighs just over 60g. Not much bigger physically than a GoPro and about the same weight as a GP3/4.

@garyhgaryh Didja get the TX and RX yet?

@ruouttaurmind Yeah I got the TX/RX last week - boscam 600mw. Man I realize my fpv project is on hold since I just sold my gopro and will deliver it next week to the new owner. I had ordered a video cable for that gopro for fpv from china. I'm going to try to mount my contour to the phantom for the time being.

@garyhgaryh I just got my Boscam TX today (200mw). In the same box as my new Tali rotors. Tali flight ban is now lifted! :-)

@ruouttaurmind Yeah let me know what you think of your boscam. I've been told the 600mw boscams are over-rated in the power department. It's more link 400 mw. The 200mw version outputs a little more.

@Wildlife I'm for from an expert but from what I've seen neither of those drones exist. Batteries last 15 to 20 minutes TOPS with a camera-loaded drone, and these things are so noisy the only wildlife you're going to be see is from 300+ feet away.
Maybe someone with more seat time will comment.

Unless you're a millionaire - then I'm sure there's solutions out there for you. As it is, your wish list puts you in the multi-thousand dollar playing field minimum.

@Wildlife you'll want one of those Predator drones owned by the U.S. Military. You can fly it so high that wildlife will have no idea it's being tracked. You'll definitely get more than 30 minutes flying time and it has infrared capability, but obtaining one is difficult :).

@Wildlife I assume from the 230v power system, you are not in the US? Flight altitude in the US is limited by the FAA to 400 feet. For #1, a DJI Phantom 3 or Walkera Scout X4 can be fitted to meet most of your criteria except flight time. Best flight time you'll see from a standard production product is about 25 minutes. But... as @Pufferfishy notes, once you load them up with all the capabilities you require, your flight time will be drastically reduced. Expect to spend around $1800 to $2000 equpped the way you describe. As far as #2, most of the capabilities you describe are already in #1 except for infared, but there's no reason you couldn't equip an IR camera and emitter if you have enough dollars to throw at it. Other than that, I don't really see any difference between the two.

@Wildlife To answer the technical stuff at the bottom... common production models can not fly in the rain. They are not waterproof and do not float. I don't see why you couldn't modify one to float, but as mentioned previously, the more stuff you load onto the aircraft, the shorter your flight time will be due to battery capacity. There are several models that can share standard batteries, but not in the class/category you're describing. Regarding controllers, I assume you're referring to the handheld transmitter (or TX). Yes, there are several manufacturers and models that can be programmed to operate a variety of different craft. I have a Devo F12e for example and I can program and store profiles for dozens of different models. Switching between them is a matter of scrolling through the on-screen menu and choosing which aircraft I'm flying at the time.

@Wildlife Thanks for the prompt and insightful feedback everyone. I'm starting to browse agricultural drone to compare flying time, etc.

@Wildlife Post back if you find something that does some sort of "silent hover" - I haven't seen anything that doesn't sound like a pack of angry bees. (lol - DJI's promo for the Phantom 3 shows one being used in a church at a wedding... riiiiiight)

@Pufferfishy Although not whisper quiet, a friend has a set of balanced Graupners on his P2 and I would say it's "very quiet" above about 15 feet. You can hear it, but not loud enough to disturb conversation. We can carry on a conversation at normal volume levels while it's hovering above. At 30 feet I'd say it really is like a whisper.

@Pufferfishy Just a quick updated. How does this make/model/spec compare to others of around the same price ? Also following up with an Agri product coming in at around 18K

@Pufferfishy with tax that ends up being a hair under $250. Still tempted.

@garyhgaryh That equals the best deal I could find on eBay. $245 from Israel. I would rather buy from Home Depot and have somplace to return it to if there's a problem! LOL! http://www.ebay.com/itm/301602712380

@garyhgaryh Even Amazon charges tax now (well - at least for both of the states I frequent)

@Pufferfishy I bought it! $247 clams. Thanks for your review bud!

@jqubed what an odd but interesting promo. I wonder if the quad shop guy knows the Olympian - or if the Olympian hawks himself at trade shows for these kinds of give-aways. A pretty cool idea, and you get paid to practice for 2 weeks straight.....

@Pufferfishy I don't know how good the practice would be against a bunch of bad amateurs in various degrees of inebriation, although personally I'm better with one beer in me. Only one, though.

@ruouttaurmind cx20? How much they run?

@garyhgaryh Nope, that's the Tali H500. And it cost a bundle. I get nervous every time I unlock the motors! ;-)

@ruouttaurmind HAHAHA! I couldn't stand the wait and took the Phantom out to "just try a quick hover". Calibrated the GPS, fired it up. Give it a little juice..... And immediately trimmed a palm tree with it. And I was all like "Well, that's enough flying today!".

Gonna wait for my $50 "trainer" to get here from China :D

@Pufferfishy No damage I hope? But... LOL! ;-)

@ruouttaurmind oh yeah we talked bout your Tali. Expensive alright! :)

@Pufferfishy lol sorry to hear. I practiced with my $12 helicopter and I have had no issues flying the phantom except the first flight when I tipped it over cuz I didn't know how much thrust to give it to lift off with a gopro hero (front heavy).

@ruouttaurmind Fortunately this was a "low altitude flame-out" so nothing but a little chlorophyll on my props! A little concerned that it "yawed" to the right like SUPER hard on lift-off. Methinks I need to revisit the manual on getting the compass and GPS calibrated again. But - like I said - I have a trainer coming (and a crash kit for it - lol) so I just need to control the urges to fly this one.....

Not sure I'm crazy about the idea of strapping something to my face, so "outboard video" options welcomed - but man, for $99 this seems like a cheap ticket to the show....

@Pufferfishy Looks like they're giving you all the parts for about what it would cost you to put them together separately. If you didn't care about the 32 channel VTX and VRX and could make due with 8 channels you could put the kit together or about $60, minus the foam face sucker thingy. For about $75 total (for an 8 ch. Boscam) you could upgrade to a 7" monitor and mount it to your RC TX. Did you have a look at the 7" monitor and mounting kit @garyhgaryh grabbed for his? In either case (the HK kit or a piece-meal kit) you'll still need a battery to power your ground station. Boscam 8ch VTX/VRX kit, $34: http://www.ebay.com/itm/371251630710 700TVL camera for $9 (or, you can simply use a cable from your new camera to the VTX): http://www.ebay.com/itm/271810703504 7 inch LCD monitor $29: http://www.ebay.com/itm/321719949001 Monitor mounting bracket $4: http://www.ebay.com/itm/251932453341

@Pufferfishy Oh, and the parts list above doesn't require any burned fingers from the soldering iron. ;-) It should be pretty much plug-n-play.

@Pufferfishy So far I've spent about $100 for my fpv system. I already have a gopro hd. My boscam 600mw tx/rx was $65. My monitor was $28. My hero video cable $5. Although not needed, I bought upgraded antennas and a 3s1p lipo battery to power the monitor for $5. So that's $103.

@Pufferfishy Oh I forgot, i bought a monitor bracket for about $8-10, so make it $110. I think my system is a little better than the HK version, but not that much better. I'm looking for fpv goggles so that HK kit would be a nice starter kit if you want fpv goggles (although it looks like a foam unit :) ).

@garyhgaryh Ya, the "goggles" are a foam facemask that holds the 4.3" LCD monitor, then uses plastic lenses to correct for focus and parallax.

@ruouttaurmind Well, after looking over all those pieces they seem just what's required.
$85 out the door after including:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/141635144232
and
http://www.ebay.com/itm/251932474694
...but I wonder if I could use the GoPro "video out cable" and skip the camera..... The plate on the camera says "Mini USB A/V Out" - so methinks YES. I've ordered one. Hope nothing smokes when I try it....

@Pufferfishy I ordered the video out cable for my gopro. When it comes I'll let you know if I can get it to work with my boscam. Please take pics when you get yours. I just got my gimbal and will post pictures soon (I just got home and it was sitting there waiting for me).

@garyhgaryh @Pufferfishy I'm anxious to see how you guys fare with your new cameras and the video-out feed. I've been searching for an elegant solution to use the Vivitar for FPV but it only has a miniHDMI that outputs a digital signal. There's no documentation that the USB will also do AV, so I'm stuck having to use a D to A converter which are expensive and start to add more weight. I'm better off replacing the camera, or perhaps just adding a simple gimbal mounted FPV cam under the Vivitar.

@ruouttaurmind If i was in your situation I'd buy a new camera. You can get a gopro like camera for $79. I heard these are decent: http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00RT43UC0/ref=wl_it_dp_o_pC_nS_ttl?_encoding=UTF8&colid=3TER2KWQR8PIT&coliid=I2XN14JT13R1CZ If you look around, 3rd party vendors sell it for less. Or get the AEE S70 or S71.

@joelmw I would probaly get a Phantom 3 dual control. Or an Inspire Professional. I REALLY like the idea of one person flying and one person controlling the camera. If I had an unlimited budget I'd get an S1000+

@joelmw the inspire 1 with dual control looks incredible, @snapster can comment on spares and accessories, I'm sure.

@joelmw I'd build a heavy lift hex or octo. It would be nice to have the option of higher payloads for better imaging options. Or even thermal or IR equipment. I'd probably go with a Pixhawk FC, The Devo F12 touch-screen TX and Devo 1202 12 channel RX, 3DR telem radios with OSD feed, Skyzone 3D FPV system, dual 22v batteries... sweet. Something similar in design to DJI's Spreading Wings platform, but using non-proprietary hardware for ultimate upgrade and configuration flexibility. Add a second TX and RX and VTX feed for dedicated gimbal control.

@Pufferfishy Ooh, I like that. I like the Phantoms because it seems like the camera is better protected.

@ruouttaurmind Yeah, I don't want to get too complicated. I'm hoping for something I can basically take out of the box and after a little bit of testing and training, take out in the field.

@joelmw DJI Spreading Wings s1000+ then. Turn-key solution!

@garyhgaryh http://postimg.org/image/avut8x9ul/

@garyhgaryh I'm jealous! I really like the silver! I also noticed, most of the weight seems to come from the motors. My 3D gimbal has significantly smaller motors, and a more well-balanced design. With the camera mounted and no power the gimbal sits level.

@garyhgaryh Hey, did your gimbal come with any documentation? I surely would like to know what all those pins do. I figured out the axis controls are the two right-most rows (when facing the front). Top is signal, bottom is ground. But I'm curious what all the other pins do.

@ruouttaurmind Which 3d gimbal did you get? You mind posting pictures of it? I think you mentioned getting a walker. Mine did not come with documentation. I'm going to request it from the seller or at least ask him to provide me with some info

I went to the seller's ebay listing and was referred to this. http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00RT43UC0/ref=wl_it_dp_o_pC_nS_ttl?_encoding=UTF8&colid=3TER2KWQR8PIT&coliid=I2XN14JT13R1CZ Here's another video related to installing it.

@garyhgaryh Mine is about half-way up this thread. Several pics of it up there. I am considering replacing it with the 120g plastic Walkera. I've got it all installed, but the hacker in me really wants to know about the super-secret functions yet to be revealed.

@garyhgaryh I really gotta read the whole message before I reply. LOL! I have the Walkera 3D gimbal on my Tali, and the same "light" gimbal you have on the CX-20.

@ruouttaurmind Ah, my controller is a BGC 2.0 gimbal controller. If you look at this video at t=7min15sec it describes where the pitch (I had a typo "Bitch") and roll pins are. Although this is a for v2.2, it should be the same (at least I'm hoping:)).

My gimbal controller is a BGC 3.1 (not 2.0). I verified by googling and matching the pc board. Then I asked the seller and he confirmed. Here is a picture of my controller. It has 4 rows of triplet pins (signal, vcc, grnd).

@ruouttaurmind lol - WOW - I love the contraption doing the testing. It even has a selfie-stick!

@ruouttaurmind lol. we must be youtube whores. I saw that too when I was trying to look for comparisons.

@Pufferfishy Maybe there's a new market for dronie selfie sticks?

@ruouttaurmind http://thisisnthappiness.com/post/117614697689/we-can-be-friends-selfie-arm

@Pufferfishy That's rich. That hand looks like a zombie prop from Walking Dead!

@ruouttaurmind I ordered bigger props. I was also looking over this http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00ECOBPE0/ but there's a number of folks that talk about complete failures in a short time, including one person that lost their entire rig over water.
Of course - you never know how adept those folks were at the work required... but still, a big gamble....

@ruouttaurmind I ordered the 9443. You want to get the genuine ones. If you buy yours from amazon and they are stampted "xoxoxo" they are conterfeits. The genuine ones are balanced and have been tested to provided extra flight time. They give more lift than the p1.1.1 props.

@garyhgaryh One of the upgrades to the P2 was these 2312 motors. A full set can be had for about $60. They're 960kv and reportedly are a bit more efficient and powerful than the original 2212 920kv motors on our P1's. Of course by the time I paid for upgraded rotors, new motors and got it all together I'd be better off just selling on the P1 and buying a new P2!

@ruouttaurmind Sure - but half the fun is the adventure of tinkering with these things.

Do the P1's have the quick connects as seen on those P2 motors? Or do you need to solder on new female sockets?

@Pufferfishy The P1, at least my P1, does not have bullet connectors from the motor to the ESC's. It's a soldered connection directly from the motor to the ESC.

@snapster wow - I cannot imagine being able to drop like $8k on quads...... Do you make money off these somehow?

DJI should start logging to the controller on these newer big dollar devices. But then, they might actually have to be accountable for failures like this.
I saw a "drone parachute" on one of the sites... maybe you should look into that.....

@snapster And can you post that image somewhere that we can see it full rez? I've been curious about the quality of their 12MP cams....

@snapster @snapster Ouch. That really sucks that it took a bath. Fantastic image though. A suitable last stand before going for a swim I suppose. And... I really want to be your friend! I'll even settle for a P3. I'm low-maintenance like that... ;-)

@snapster I saw a youtube video of a guy complaining that his phantom vision 2+ just dropped out of the sky. He had it on video and I can tell that he accidently shut it off in flight. If you hold the left lever down past the detent, it will power the phantom off in 2-3 secs. That's what he did. You can hear the lever pop back up. I was not the only one that noticed this by reading the comments. I'm not saying you did this, but it would be something to review.

@garyhgaryh ah that's interesting. Honestly I'd be fine taking full blame if it were something this simple. I'm pretty sure the I1 won't just turn off mid-flight from moving both joysticks in, though. It's pretty self-aware.

@Pufferfishy I had the dual controller model and of course the controllers and extra batteries and all are fine. $2800 for another full unit but minus the controller and battery if I sold them I'd have $2k actual replacement cost. Plus with the salvage unit I have a workable camera and gimble (for when they come out with the new hand-held gimble) and replacement parts galore. I'm certainly in a category of being able to afford extravagant hobbies but I'd say this one is in the higher midrange even eating that cost. $100 an hour?

@Pufferfishy I saw an exchange with a tech saying not to reset before obtaining the log so I'm hoping there's some way to get that (which is mostly why I wrote in to service)

@Pufferfishy this image is actually a still from the 4k footage displayed on a macbook retina and screen grabbed. So here's the best source I have but I think it's like half resolution (right click and open this into new tab, then select download function on dropbox)

@garyhgaryh So if you DO kill the motors and go into a free-fall - will restarting them (holding at 10:00 and 2:00) all you to "save" it?

Given that the Inspire is altitude aware I would REALLY hope that it won't allow the motors to be shut off.

@snapster link appears broken

@snapster Do you use any ground station program when you fly? That would have your telem data logs. Obviously if it was a straight up power loss, data would abruptly stop. But perhaps there's something meaningful there leading up to the event.

@ruouttaurmind yeah, Inspire 1 has a pilot app. It initially showed me last position but then that cleared off so I'm not sure if I'll find it has the logs or not. I'll have to research before the replacement drone gets flown.

@Pufferfishy I figured would post as broken link - right click on the ? and open it to new tab.

@snapster That image is really impressive. Sorry to hear about the crash. The Inspire is incredible, especially considering it's already replacing helicopter shots on TV and in movies. It's exciting as a hobbyist filmmaker.

Is it possible someone "squatted" on your frequency? I know these things can channel hop, but I've never actually see what happens when there's multiple devices on the same channel...

(PS - I see no "?" - all I see is an icon for a broken image and there's nothing linked under it - but don't sweat it)

@garyhgaryh

logs show regular descent started only left stick engaged on last data before power outage.

@snapster :( "only left stick engaged" - and I see it at 100%. Does that mean that you did, in fact, call a power-off???

@Pufferfishy @snapster Wow, that really happened? Thanks for the update @snapster! I love the flight recorder. Is that an app?

@Pufferfishy Yes, you should be able to restart the motors after you kill it in freefall. I haven't tried it but I see no reason why it cannot be restarted as if it was at rest.

@Pufferfishy left stick down is simply a descent - power off is sticks angled in to each other (the Combination Stick Command or CSC)

@snapster Left stick down past the detent is motor off on th P1 and p2. There are many ways to turn off the motors, including what you mentioned above.

@garyhgaryh Actually - you don't even have to go past the detent - if you hold it, the motors stop. At least that is the case on mine

@garyhgaryh there's no detent on the I1 (that I'm aware of). so if you do a straight decline on the P1/P2 the motors turn off or is the detent perceptible enough it wouldn't happen to an experienced pilot?

@snapster it's perceptible. I've used down for over 3-4 secs with no shutdown. If I pass the detention shutdown is imminent after 3-4 secs.

@Pufferfishy I'll try this. I don't think it happens on mine but I'll verify today.

@Pufferfishy going straight down will not shut off the motor. You have to go past the detent and keep it there for about 3 secs for the motors to turn off. So if you're descending you have no worries. Go past the detent for 3 secs and the motors go off. That's why the detent is there. So an experienced piliot will most likely not make the mistake of shutting down the motors as they descend because they will not go past the detent.

@garyhgaryh ok thanks - I think my confusion is the Inspire 1 control may not have this detent (or possibly even this mode). It does have a shut down when pushing down after a landing though.

@ruouttaurmind that's actually a clone of an SJCam SJ4000. The actual SJCams run around $80 and say SJCam on the front. For instance http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1072775-REG

@zippyus It's my understanding the early production run SJ4000 were not marked with SJCam logo and they started doing that in response to the counterfeits. For example, this image from the official SJCam website is not marked:

@ruouttaurmind Will you be buying this $35 camera? Might be good enough for fpv.

@garyhgaryh I think it's worth a shot. I'd have at least $35 into the bits to make my Vivitar talk to my VTX. With this SJ4000 I only need a $3 AV/USB cable (the same ones used for GoPro). And the picture quality should be at least equal to my cheap Vivitar. For $35 it's worth a try. If I'm dissatisfied with it I can always sell it at my next yard sale or list it back on eBay. Ya, I'm going to order one this weekend.

@ruouttaurmind Where did you see these for $35?? I can't seem to find a trace of it.... including on dx.com....

@Pufferfishy I'm not sure if you're referring to the SJCam clone or the AtoD converter for HDMI, so here's both: eBay SJ4000 1080p Clone ($35): www.ebay.com/itm/201315597606 A to D HDMI to A/V converter ($32): http://www.ebay.com/itm/331500297887

@ruouttaurmind wow - my google-foo sucks today. Thanks - I was looking at the camera. I figured, hell, for $35 I'll get one to play with.

Wow - the sensor is only 1.3MP. There's no way this thing can do 1080p and look good. There's 5MP 1080p cams on Woot today for $60... I will probably go that route.....

@Pufferfishy Wow, that's horrible. The real SJ4000 has the Aptina AR0330 which has about three times the resolution. Thanks for pointing that out. I wouldn't want to drop even $35 on some interpolated image shifting POS.

@garyhgaryh Good work! I like the wider landing gear. I'd like to see how it looks with your new camera mounted! Have you installed the VTX yet?

@ruouttaurmind Here's a picture of it with my gopro. I also figured a way to set it so you can preset the tilt. I don't have the tilt hooked up yet. I have not installed the vtx. The power wiring is temporary until I get my balance plug connectors from hobby king.

The p1.1.1 has no problem with the weight of the camera and gimbal, but landing is an issue now. I keep tipping over when landing. I'm thinking about putting an extension to the landing gear to keep this from happing. It is really front heavy now. I took some videos of it flying around and the gimbal works great!!

@garyhgaryh Looks good! How you gonna power the VTX? Through the same balance connector? Just curious... are you aware of the spare power wires hanging out under the Phantom?

@ruouttaurmind Yes, I'm going to put two balance plug on that spare power wire for both the gimbal and the vtx. Or i might hardwire the vtx if i put it inside the phantom. My next project for the p1.1.1 is fpv. I just review the video of the short flight around the park with the gimbal and it's absolutely amazing what a gimbal can do to your videos. I get the s71 camera tomorrow.. things are moving fast... once I get fpv I'll be a happy dog.. just need to get my multistar 4000 battery (it's on backorder) and my gps tracker.

@ruouttaurmind I wondered what those were. Mine tucked themselves back into the chassis almost immediately - there was like 1/1000th of an inch showing when I took it from the box :(

@Pufferfishy That's just a rubber plug they were poking through. If you're not feeling the adventure of opening up the shell, just pop out that rubber plug and (Puffer)fish the wires back out, press the plug in place and you're set!

I just flew my p1.1.1. I used to get about 10-12 mins with just my gopro attached. With the gimbal I'm getting about 8 mins of flying time, but the videos are much more usable than before.

@ruouttaurmind

@Wildlife That's a pretty sweet setup. Any advantage to the long arms and huge props?

@Wildlife I like the charger!

@garyhgaryh That's the iMAX B6. I have it's little brother: Awesome charger provides a ton of feedback as it's processing the charging cycle. Even has a discharge and storage mode.

@ruouttaurmind Does that come with a Power supply or do you need to purchase one? I'd like to charge all my batteries at once :). Looks like amazon has it for cheap: http://www.amazon.com/Battery-Balance-Charger-Li-ion-Batteries/dp/B005EF15Q4/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1430351127&sr=8-1&keywords=imax+b6

@garyhgaryh Power supply was a separate item, but that was an easy $6 on eBay for a OEM Toshiba 15v4a power supply. Input voltage is 11-18vdc. I just fished around on eBay 'till I found one that matches the iMax branded supply (15v4a) and had the right size plug (3mm tip).

@garyhgaryh If you're seriously considering one, get the model B6AC. It has the power supply build in. They're running $29 on eBay. Then you won't have to chase down a power supply. Just make sure the one you order has the correct power plug for USA.

@ruouttaurmind Thanks! I'll check that out. Appreciate the info!

@ruouttaurmind i realize the copycats are in the $30 range. If you want the remacoy, you'll have to pay about $60.

@garyhgaryh You mean the iMax chargers? You suppose that's a copy there? http://www.ebay.com/itm/281677202115 Ya, I guess I see what you're saying. It's a "iMax B6AC", but not a SKYRC iMax B6RC. I guess I didn't know there were clones out there. I'll have to check mine when I get home. It works well enough either way, but it would be nice to know.

@ruouttaurmind Holy crap - what does that bad-boy cost?
It looks a little ungainly tho....
I love that they use it to drop a Phantom!

I doubt that I'm ever going to graduate to "hear removing capability" - and this thing looks like it could really do some damage if it goes rogue...

@ruouttaurmind One word: Wow!

@ruouttaurmind http://www.risingresearch.com/en/dvr/ or http://www.filerepair1.com/ - haven't personally vetted but a quick search turned these free tools up. Couldn't hurt to try on a copy of your video.

@ruouttaurmind VLC can probably play it still, and it also does video conversions so you might be able to export a working version.

@jqubed +1 for VLC - it was written to play torrents as they DL - so it's REALLY good with partials.....

@ruouttaurmind I ended up using a command line fixing tool that had commands for closing DJI video files correctly after corruption by improper power outage. I remember starting here but not having luck with this tool http://skypixel.org/post/110526362109 I'll have to look on my macbook for the one that worked out.

@ruouttaurmind ok so remembering better - I used this tool http://live555.com/drones/DJI-Phantom-2-Vision+-video-fix/ after trying something called Yodot MOV repair. Yodot appeared to work but output file was just a green screen. DJIFIX actually failed when I selected Inspire 1 video option and then succeeded when I told it it was 4k 30fps generic video. It created an H.264 video that would only play by VLC but I converted that using YoDot to .MOV for better playback performance in Quicktime. Also - sorry to hear about your crash!

@snapster I appreciate any info you can offer. Repairing the damage to the Tali will be easy enough; just time and money. But it would be nice to have at least something to show for the expense. I had the camera recording from takeoff to graceless landing so the one file is over 20 minutes of video. Hate to lose it all.

@ruouttaurmind agreed - I was feeling the same way. sadly my video cut out without even a hint of the crash to come. Kind of a boring "black box".

@snapster Thanks for the sentiment. With the sting of your incident so fresh, I have no doubt you can empathize. Fortunatley I was able to download telem logs from the Tali and can learn from the experience. When I get it all back together I'll be bumping my level one LV warning to 22.8v and my audibles to 22.5v. I was amazed how quickly it went from 22.4v to rubble (48 seconds in the log). I also learned not to ignore first level LV warning! LOL!

@Pufferfishy @jqubed Tried VLC but it errs out right after selecting the file. Something about an unrecognized file type. I also tried Remo Repair and YDot. No luck, but I did manage to get a host of leechware on my system. Fortunately I keep an old Vista machine specifically for doing junk like this, and a ghost image of the clean OS so I started the disk image recovery before I left for work. By the time I get home it'll be all tidy and ready for the next injection of crapware. @djslack, thanks for the suggestions. I'll try a few more tonight.

@ruouttaurmind You could also try MPEG Streamclip or ffmpeg if you don't mind dipping into the command line. I'd say @snapster's solution sounds the most promising, though.

@garyhgaryh Lookin' good! You're really making progress. You know you can pull those unused pins out of the balance connectors by pressing the little tab wtih a small screwdriver. It'll tidy things up on that end. Or if you're ambitious, you can use JST connectors which are a bit smaller and more streamlined. You'll find that most of the off-the-shelf connectors for VTX, GoPro, etc use JST.

@ruouttaurmind Yes I know about removing the pins, but I didn't even think about that.. lol. I was excited to get started and to finish asap. Yeah those JST connectors would have been a solution and cheaper. Should have gone that route. I guess this is what this forum is about - to exchange ideas and help each other out...

@Pufferfishy have a great trip! I'll add to the spread sheet when i get the chance.

@garyhgaryh Wow, that's very awesome! I'm so jealous of you and Puff and your very cool AEE cameras. Unfortunately I just laid out a pile of dosh on Tali repair parts so I've got to put my FPV project on hold for a couple of weeks, but I'm really anxious to see some videos from you guys!

@garyhgaryh PS: maybe if you strip the VTX out of it's enclosure when you mount it, it'll get a bit more circulation and stay cooler? Mine doesn't have any casing on it. I'm hoping the prop wash alone will be enough to keep it from overheating too much, but I'm definitely going to be mounting it away from the body a bit. Maybe on some nylon standoffs so it can get air circulation all around. I'm a bit concerned if I mount it directly to the body it'll heat up enough to melt the plastic.

@ruouttaurmind Don't be jealous about the S71 AEE cameras. It does not appear to support a live video feed. There does not seem to be a composite video source/feed on the camera. There is a mini HDMI, but what am I going to do with a digital signal. Does HDMI work only on playback or will it display a live HDMI feed for what the camera is seeing at all times? There are converters, but I don't want to go that route. I emailed their tech support to see if the usb port supports AV out with composite video. I might have to return this camera if I can't find a way to get a live feed from it.

@garyhgaryh That's exactly the same boat I'm in with my Vivitar action cam. Mini HDMI output but no analog video feed, so I'd have to have one of those DtoA converters made for the Sony (pictured below). The $35 SJCam clone sounds like a better option all the time.

@ruouttaurmind I plan to put a small heat sink (old 286 CPU) on mine

@garyhgaryh The port is labeled "USB/AV" - let us know what AEE support says. I have a cable coming - I assumed the label meant that it did the composite out.....
This would suck - I really didn't want to use an out-board cam... but I have one.

Oh - and I read that these things will get hot when they have crap antennas as well..... I know the 600mW ones will burn up if you even power them with no antenna attached.

@Pufferfishy I saw that and I am trying to reach out to their support to find out if it supports composite video. Where did you get the cable? I couldn't find it anywhere. I did see the other day a vendor on ebay selling a gopro/S71 usb av cable so I'm slightly optimistic there, but when I couldn't find it on any site esp the bhphoto site (they are big AEE distributor), then I thought this was a waste of time for me. Lets hope the S71 uses the same cable as the hero.

@ruouttaurmind How much is that hdmi to composite converter? You have a link to it? If more than 35 go with the sj clone.

@garyhgaryh Yeah - I just bought a $3 GoPro cable hoping that the AEE is pinned the same.

@Pufferfishy hahaha.. before I left the house this morning I ordered a $2 (99 cent for the cable and 1.00 for shipping from china) usb gopro AV cable hoping it would work.... Great minds think alike.

A quick search for "AEE S71 FPV cable" found this at HK. No idea if it's helpful. Do you have such a port on your AEE? 46369_GoPro_Live_A_V_Out_FPV_Cable_90deg_Version.html">http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/_46369_GoPro_Live_A_V_Out_FPV_Cable_90deg_Version.html

I have NO idea WTF is up with the link. No matter what I do it won't print the link properly? Anyhoo... go to HK and search for AEE FPV cable...