Would love to hear a recording of how this sounds from street level. Seems like something could be lost in the delivery but much respect for the city doing something like this.
Apparently at this festival they do lots of performances with singers and other instruments, so they pipe that out over a PA as well. It looks like a really fun thing to experience.
I might know from experience that having a carillon play really crazy music can sound like an explosion at a bell factory. Having the accompaniment helps for sure.
@ExtraMedium In the tower you hear the banging of the carillon keys on the keyboard and the overtones of the bells are far more harsh. From the ground the music is “sweeter” as the overtones blend in more and no banging is heard (I play the carillon). Of course poorly tuned bells (they tune them permanently by scraping away parts of the inside of each bell so it vibrates at just the right pitch) makes all music sound worse and some lose their longer “ring” when they have been corroded by pigeon shit (the acid eats away at the bells) or air pollution.
Also the foundries have different ideas of what makes the “ideal” bell sound. Taylor bells, for example have fantastic base bells but the higher ones sound “tinny”. Eijsbouts has really sweet and clear higher bells but the base ones aren’t as strong base overpowering… If the bell hammers haven’t been rotated for a bit the bells will sound “duller” as more of the hammer will hit the bell… How high the tower is affects what is heard on the ground as well (as does traffic noise, etc.).
@djdlack - some of the carillon music I call “crash bang” music and I don’t like that much. I prefer melodic carillon music that pays attention to the minor 3rd overtone in the bells and is written (or arranged) with that in mind.
@Kyeh Yup. I play the carillon and have seen in person some carillon + other musical instruments either with a traveling carillon or in a tower or in a tower plus on the ground.
@Kyeh I have heard, but not played, with other instruments. I have played arrangements of “non classical” music on the carillon (although the bulk of the repertoire is classical or Dutch/Belgium folks tunes - instrument has been around since the 16th century and was first “invented” in that area of Europe thus those kinds of what we now are calling folk tunes - although “modern” compositions, arrangements, etc, are growing in number) including some arrangements I have written, a couple of which have been played in other people’s recitals/concerts.
Logistically it requires a handful of people to pull off coordinating what is going on in the tower and ground or in some cases within the tower only so the ground can hear it. One concert I was at in the Netherlands had brass standing around the edge of the bells at the openings of the tower and small orchestra on the ground. There was a video feed for the carillonneur to see the conductor on the ground. It was, I think, in Eindhoven if I recall correctly (that city is near the Eijsbouts bell foundry which is in Asten where I lived at the time). This was years ago. I would presume it is now easier to coordinate all of this due to wifi now, etc.
And for those that wonder (or not), there are practice instruments so that when someone is learning a song the world is not subjected to them learning it. They are very expensive so generally one does not have one at home, rather they are in the tower somewhere. I did own a very used one at one point but had to sell it to pay for medical expenses. There are no carillons in this state and I am losing my repertoire because I am not playing one often enough to hang on to most of it. It will take a lot of practice to get it back. Makes me sad.
@Kidsandliz@Kyeh Funny you should mention the practice instruments. I had that question as I watched several videos of really complex pieces.
I would think you could simulate the feel of the keys using springs and counterweights, attach that to a magnetic pickup or accelerometer and then feed those to a bank of electronics. Sounds like an epic Raspberry pi/Arduino maker project. Or just feed the movement output of the key mechanism to a hacked electronic piano with carillon sound samples. Granted, you’d have to make dozens of the key/spring/weight mechanisms, but once you’ve figured out the design of the first, you could make a little assembly line to knock out all of the copies.
Then you could make a YouTube video which would go viral among the worlds carillonists, and making you an overnight sensation. You would quickly realize that making carillon videos was your calling and spend all of your time on your Kidsandliz Carillon channel. And then wouldn’t have time to actually practice the carillon.
Never mind…
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
@Kyeh@mehcuda67 There are some practice instruments that actually do have simulated carillon sounds but most just have metal sound bars. Usually there are springs in the back of the baton (key) and they don’t bother with weighting them differently (eg on a carillon the base clapper is bigger and heavier than on a treble bell so the effort to push the baton down varies). There are so many different “standards” over time about the actual spacing of the batons and pedals on the instruments that you get used to switching between the “feel” of the practice instrument and the carillon, between one carillon and a different one. They mind blowing expensive to begin with and I don’t think most people would pay even more for something “fancy” and more “life like”.
There are a fair number of carillon videos online. Some with other musical instruments involved, some with a traveling carillon, some just the carillon alone.
@Kidsandliz@djslack I didn’t realize this was a thing. I looked up my favorite bell tower, the Belfort in Bruges. Unfortunately, I found only David Bowie’s “Space Oddity” and Queen’s “Bohemian Rhapsody” without a view of the carillonist. And no guitar, though that’s understandable - lugging a guitar and amp up 366 circular stairs would be daunting!
That carillon is at the top of a museum of ridiculously large (and small) music-playing machines, the Speelklok Museum in Utrecht. One of the devices now housed there as a permanent contribution is the original Wintergatan Marble Machine. This thing:
The creator is currently working on the replacement, a much more ambitious version with greater reliability, more instruments, and hopefully no playing errors.
@werehatrack That museum is beyond wonderful. I happened to be in Utrecht and my carillon teacher arranged for me to go up the tower with the carillonneur when he played his weekly recital. He then took me to the museum and arranged for them to give me a personal tour playing every single “instrument” and music box in that museum that worked. That was so fantastic. It is worth seeing if you happen to be in the Netherlands. Tiny country so doesn’t take more than a couple of hours to get from one side to the other.
Would love to hear a recording of how this sounds from street level. Seems like something could be lost in the delivery but much respect for the city doing something like this.
RIP Lemmy
@ExtraMedium here you go
Apparently at this festival they do lots of performances with singers and other instruments, so they pipe that out over a PA as well. It looks like a really fun thing to experience.
I might know from experience that having a carillon play really crazy music can sound like an explosion at a bell factory. Having the accompaniment helps for sure.
@ExtraMedium In the tower you hear the banging of the carillon keys on the keyboard and the overtones of the bells are far more harsh. From the ground the music is “sweeter” as the overtones blend in more and no banging is heard (I play the carillon). Of course poorly tuned bells (they tune them permanently by scraping away parts of the inside of each bell so it vibrates at just the right pitch) makes all music sound worse and some lose their longer “ring” when they have been corroded by pigeon shit (the acid eats away at the bells) or air pollution.
Also the foundries have different ideas of what makes the “ideal” bell sound. Taylor bells, for example have fantastic base bells but the higher ones sound “tinny”. Eijsbouts has really sweet and clear higher bells but the base ones aren’t as strong base overpowering… If the bell hammers haven’t been rotated for a bit the bells will sound “duller” as more of the hammer will hit the bell… How high the tower is affects what is heard on the ground as well (as does traffic noise, etc.).
@djdlack - some of the carillon music I call “crash bang” music and I don’t like that much. I prefer melodic carillon music that pays attention to the minor 3rd overtone in the bells and is written (or arranged) with that in mind.
Fantastic! @Kidsandliz - this is right up your alley!
@Kyeh Yup. I play the carillon and have seen in person some carillon + other musical instruments either with a traveling carillon or in a tower or in a tower plus on the ground.
@Kidsandliz
I know - that’s why I “@-ed” you. But have you heard or played rock music on them?
@Kyeh I have heard, but not played, with other instruments. I have played arrangements of “non classical” music on the carillon (although the bulk of the repertoire is classical or Dutch/Belgium folks tunes - instrument has been around since the 16th century and was first “invented” in that area of Europe thus those kinds of what we now are calling folk tunes - although “modern” compositions, arrangements, etc, are growing in number) including some arrangements I have written, a couple of which have been played in other people’s recitals/concerts.
Logistically it requires a handful of people to pull off coordinating what is going on in the tower and ground or in some cases within the tower only so the ground can hear it. One concert I was at in the Netherlands had brass standing around the edge of the bells at the openings of the tower and small orchestra on the ground. There was a video feed for the carillonneur to see the conductor on the ground. It was, I think, in Eindhoven if I recall correctly (that city is near the Eijsbouts bell foundry which is in Asten where I lived at the time). This was years ago. I would presume it is now easier to coordinate all of this due to wifi now, etc.
And for those that wonder (or not), there are practice instruments so that when someone is learning a song the world is not subjected to them learning it. They are very expensive so generally one does not have one at home, rather they are in the tower somewhere. I did own a very used one at one point but had to sell it to pay for medical expenses. There are no carillons in this state and I am losing my repertoire because I am not playing one often enough to hang on to most of it. It will take a lot of practice to get it back. Makes me sad.
@Kidsandliz @Kyeh Funny you should mention the practice instruments. I had that question as I watched several videos of really complex pieces.
I would think you could simulate the feel of the keys using springs and counterweights, attach that to a magnetic pickup or accelerometer and then feed those to a bank of electronics. Sounds like an epic Raspberry pi/Arduino maker project. Or just feed the movement output of the key mechanism to a hacked electronic piano with carillon sound samples. Granted, you’d have to make dozens of the key/spring/weight mechanisms, but once you’ve figured out the design of the first, you could make a little assembly line to knock out all of the copies.
Then you could make a YouTube video which would go viral among the worlds carillonists, and making you an overnight sensation. You would quickly realize that making carillon videos was your calling and spend all of your time on your Kidsandliz Carillon channel. And then wouldn’t have time to actually practice the carillon.
Never mind…
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
@Kyeh @mehcuda67 There are some practice instruments that actually do have simulated carillon sounds but most just have metal sound bars. Usually there are springs in the back of the baton (key) and they don’t bother with weighting them differently (eg on a carillon the base clapper is bigger and heavier than on a treble bell so the effort to push the baton down varies). There are so many different “standards” over time about the actual spacing of the batons and pedals on the instruments that you get used to switching between the “feel” of the practice instrument and the carillon, between one carillon and a different one. They mind blowing expensive to begin with and I don’t think most people would pay even more for something “fancy” and more “life like”.
Just needs a shootout in a convenience store while the clerk plays video games.
There are a fair number of carillon videos online. Some with other musical instruments involved, some with a traveling carillon, some just the carillon alone.
@Kidsandliz @djslack I didn’t realize this was a thing. I looked up my favorite bell tower, the Belfort in Bruges. Unfortunately, I found only David Bowie’s “Space Oddity” and Queen’s “Bohemian Rhapsody” without a view of the carillonist. And no guitar, though that’s understandable - lugging a guitar and amp up 366 circular stairs would be daunting!
That carillon is at the top of a museum of ridiculously large (and small) music-playing machines, the Speelklok Museum in Utrecht. One of the devices now housed there as a permanent contribution is the original Wintergatan Marble Machine. This thing:
The creator is currently working on the replacement, a much more ambitious version with greater reliability, more instruments, and hopefully no playing errors.
@werehatrack
OMG!
I love everything about that so much!!!
@werehatrack Marble Machine is so awe some.
@werehatrack That museum is beyond wonderful. I happened to be in Utrecht and my carillon teacher arranged for me to go up the tower with the carillonneur when he played his weekly recital. He then took me to the museum and arranged for them to give me a personal tour playing every single “instrument” and music box in that museum that worked. That was so fantastic. It is worth seeing if you happen to be in the Netherlands. Tiny country so doesn’t take more than a couple of hours to get from one side to the other.