@blaineg To expand on that, stupid billionaires (or mere millionaires) paying stupid money to take stupid chances on a stupidly designed submersible, operated by a clown that thinks safety regulations are stupid.
Spend the money being wasted on the recuse effort helping people that are in need.
@blaineg Much like treks to the top of Everest. Expensive, dangerous, serves no purpose other than self-indulgence, and damages the environment. I would not wish ill on any of the participants, but they did know the risks. I hope the debris field is evidence that the vessel imploded around the time they lost contact, as that is a better outcome than the alternatives.
@blaineg@rockblossom I am heading reports that the Navy heard a sound around just after they lost contact, sounding like an Implosion. At least that means they probably didn’t suffer and it was sudden which is a better way to go in that case is it’s not long and drawn out.
@blaineg: To expand on that, stupid billionaires (or mere millionaires) paying stupid money to take stupid chances on a stupidly designed submersible, operated by a clown that thinks safety regulations are stupid.
Spend the money being wasted on the recuse effort helping people that are in need.
@blaineg@rockblossom Just the amount of fuel used in the rescue efforts must have such a ridiculous cost in money and environmental damage.
Also, I’m no engineer, but I wouldn’t think carbon fiber to be a great choice of material to expose to such extreme pressure repeatedly. It has like zero give, when you hit its limit, it just breaks.
@blaineg@Bretterson@rockblossom They use carbon fiber in some planes. Just hope they do regular safety checks because apparently it can become brittle.
@blaineg@Bretterson@gogrrl@narfcake@rockblossom@sammydog01 I’d agree many people don’t understand the physics involved. And yet I still loved that submarine ride at the original Anaheim Disneyland. Anybody remember that? Is the submarine ride still there?
@blaineg@Bretterson@narfcake@pmarin@rockblossom@sammydog01
I should have been more clear on the point I was making with use on airplanes. I am well aware there is a huge difference in pressure on this material on an airplane versus the Titan at those depths. The info I read was not in relation to a catastrophic failure in the air. It was referring to the material possibly becoming brittle and how that may affect “hard landings” or “plane crash survivability”. I honestly didn’t go down that rabbit hole too much…it seems to have been disproven for the most part from what I could glean. It sure wouldn’t keep me from airplane travel in any case.
Although some airlines still manage to mess up and not do their jobs. I have somehow gotten a channel or two worked into my suggestions that cover them. I don’t think you’ll see one related to the fuselage unless the required inspections/maintenance weren’t done properly.
NOAA and NO-ONE don’t inspect private submersibles for safety…
@blaineg Futile, as an implosion at that depth - with around 375 atmospheres of pressure at the Titanic wreck - would leave nothing recognizable to retrieve. Much better to leave it in place.
Sad, but given the inherent risks (which were signed away by the passengers) and the company’s past attitude about safety regulations, am not surprised about the outcome either.
@sammydog01 I’d say OK maybe, but really not that much. There are tons of things a teenager (and he was almost 20) can do with their father, or mother, or friends from college that may result in risk. truck rollovers, boats capsizing, hunting accident, bitten by poisonous spider. sorry but it happens.
In this case yes it was more ´extreme’ in terms of something that has (almost) never been done before, in a vessel of questionable reliability. But I would also say that the news likes drama and death, and promotes it heavily because guess what, it makes you watch and gives them ad revenue (and I’m not anti-media in any way but I recognize this is what it does). Right now I have the news on in the background and the main topics are about filing lawsuits and making laws to regulate expeditions (which isn’t practical anyway in international waters).
Funny thing is that last week I saw a PBS documentary on the Titanic and how a hasty congressional investigation and major newspapers accused the captain of another ship for not stopping to help the doomed Titanic passengers. And now with new evidence they figured out that ship and the wrongly-accused captain were far away on the other side of the ice field, and it was a totally different Canadian ship that was the one the survivors reported seeing in the distance. And the first captain’s career was ruined, but I bet they sold a lot of newspapers.
@sammydog01 Of course, yes I think it’s sad too. And if my 70 year old neighbor who loves to go hunting dies in a hunting accident I’d think the same thing. I think for one, I don’t know much about the relationship between this ‘young man’ (legally an adult) and his father. I’d say of course he may have been apprehensive, I would be too. A relationship between a mature son and a father is always complicated. If I could guess it would be a combination of ‘I want to please my father,’ ‘it would be F-ing cool’, and ‘I’m scared as S$#^.’ I don’t know but it would be my feeling in that situation.
But the news for a while was focusing on a ‘child’ being forced to do something and then losing their life because of it, and how we need new laws and regulations. That is where I feel the news stories were running with that as a main topic for a while. The fact is that news is sold (in the old days papers, nowadays ‘clicks’) based on creating a mix of pity and outrage. It’s very profitable.
It is truly sad, but the company had a number of complaints, even from others in the field. Today the film maker of the Movie Titanic had a comment .
It is still even experimental venture, like what Blue Horizon is doing.
I’m just glad that Josh Gates had enough sense to stay FAR away from that Rush dude. Josh was going to film a show about the Titan, but once he saw the company’s shoddy approach to safety & haphazard way of putting together a plan of action, he practically ran in the other direction. I always knew he was wicked smaht!
yep, risky adventures they knew they were getting into. do you know how many frozen Mt Everest climber bodies they have to haul away every year if they even find them?
I’d still want to go to space if there was a way, but not on the Bezos Space Penis. But probably would not pass medical checks. on the other hand they let William Shatner on.
but in honoring the great movie Airplane I must add this
/youtube airplane counter point let them crash
do you know how many frozen Mt Everest climber bodies they have to haul away every year if they even find them?
I think very few people outside of Nepal know how deadly that site is. This year (2023) alone there were 17 dead or missing-presumed-dead on Everest. And there will be more next year and the year after that, and we will not care or even know their names. Honestly, the only ones I might mourn are the Sherpas, who do it for money and not ego.
The other fascinating topic here is that deep sea, especially submarine rescue and salvage, has been a heavily secret venture of the US as well as Russian and now I assume other governments. This has been going on for at least 70 years and I don’t know it’s not continuing. There are many books on this after material from the 1950s-60s was declassified, but I’m sure there is a lot more.
My question when this started was many top secret vessels and technologies would the US or other governments be willing to expose? Of course there was the logistics of getting out to that place in a timely manner, which I think we now know would not have mattered anyway. But there is a long history of secrets related to deep sea capabilities.
EDIT or maybe those secrets were in those documents at Mar-a-Lago?
@Kyeh I notice that article didn’t say how many millions and millions this already has and will cost. If 5 people die on Everest they are basically out of luck beyond what other people already present can or can not do.
@Kyeh I’m sure there will be estimates but how much extra money that was spent will probably not be one of them. If the Coast Guard already had employees on the clock and owned the equipment those dollars were already gone. The press likes to make numbers big.
@Kidsandliz@Kyeh@sammydog01 While the response did seem a bit excessive, i think the military often treats events like this as real-world training exercises, so they’re more prepared when they lose or need to recover assets that are important to national security &/or rescue personnel, which should always be a top priority. So, i would imagine they consider that a mitigating factor when accounting for the costs.
@Kyeh@Kidsandliz Particularly troubling in light of this revelation according to WSJ:
A top secret military acoustic detection system designed to spot enemy submarines first heard what the U.S. Navy suspected was the Titan submersible implosion hours after the submersible began its voyage, officials involved in the search said.
The Navy began listening for the Titan almost as soon as the sub lost communications, according to a U.S. defense official. Shortly after the submersible’s disappearance Sunday, the U.S. system detected what it suspected was the sound of an implosion near the debris site discovered Thursday and reported its findings to the Coast Guard commander on site, U.S. defense officials said.
@Kyeh@macromeh That would imply they decided to turn this into a search training exercise rather than going straight to the signal (knowing everyone was dead). I did read elsewhere that that signal was used to triangulate where the sub likely was. Who knows what is really true if some of this/the tech is top secret.
@Kidsandliz@Kyeh@sammydog01@macromeh The reports I’ve been hearing are that, when word of the sound started circulating, combined with the simultaneous loss of communication & tracking, all the experts and people in the deep-sea sub community were fairly certain it was an implosion, but because of the nature of the technology, it can never be 100% definitive.
@ircon96@Kidsandliz@Kyeh@macromeh@sammydog01 Yes catastrophic implosions (is there any other kind?) have been well-known and understood for years (a century or so) in that community, so I’m sure it was like ‘yup, that was it.’ And I don’t think any submariner doesn’t know this is a possibility. At least mercifully it’s likely to be very quick.
Also previous to this, look up the Glomar Explorer. Supposedly built for ocean mineral exploration but was really a secret military operation to retrieve a submarine.
So there is often a “cover story” and years later as things are declassified or info leaks out, we learn cool history. Which is why I wondered how much current deep-sea secret tech would be exposed in this, given several countries and every news channel in the world covering it.
@pmarin thinking about it, would not be surprised if there were Russian or Chinese subs in the area just watching what equipment we deployed. Though they can’t go that deep either as far as I know. But enough to learn stuff.
I think all the search vessels were US, Canada, France, and as they are close allies it is possible that extra information was shared with them at some point.
If there were ‘enemy’ subs in the area very possibly the US would have known about it. I worked with a guy that was a ‘sonarman’ on a Navy sub (1970s-early 80s). He said ‘we would know where they were, they would know where we were.’ And of course this was before whatever secret underwater sensor network might exist now that was apparently partially revealed this week.
@pmarin It would not surprise me to hear that the Titan was being watched/listened from the beginning of the dive. Seems like it would be a good training and testing opportunity. I read somewhere that the search was needed to find proof that could be shown beyond “we heard it implode”. With the international audience and none military people involved steps needed to be documented.
If I’m being honest… I just don’t… care? It shouldn’t even be real news. Other than people turned it into news because some wealthy people died in a way they could make sound interesting and fill their 24/7 news cycle for a few days with some made up suspense when everyone knew they were dead.
And other people turned the search into a circus.
5 people died doing something dangerous is not a world wide headline. It’s barely even noteworthy in the death statistics. So… IDK…
@medz with an airliner there’s at least some chance that they managed to ditch and there are survivors in a raft or something. Not much but some. And investigations into what happened generally improve airline safety/correct defects/prevent future accidents/help restore public faith/punish bad actors. The why actually matters there. I don’t really pay any attention to those on the news either though.
I’m more of a this happened/why it happened/what are we doing about it person. The whole constant public news watch/wild speculating I just don’t get.
@Kyeh@medz@unksol
Hmm, posted this but not sure what youtube will dig up – never seen the live version.
The key lyric is “it’s interesting when people die; we love dirty laundry” and also talks about plane crashes and scandals the main goal of news outlets (as I said earlier, used to be newspapers, then TV, now it’s internet clicks). The key is making something provocative, tragic, outraging. Sometimes the outrage has to be manufactured, but they’ve become very good at manufacturing that. Probably the last thing we actually manufacture in this country.
@Kyeh@medz@pmarin I don’t know how to fix the news. Some are worse than others. There’s some that are just straight up propaganda but it’s all influenced.
I mostly read it because at least then, just based on the title and the source, I can decide if it’s worth reading. Clickbait titles/dishonest outlets/the hourly sub report saying the same thing… can be avoided.
Granted I’m still reading a selection of free articles from journalists not being paid that a bot picked to show me.
And I’m picking what interests me. There’s a metric ton of bias built in. Some intentional some not. In what we consider the news these days
Probably how a certain someone gets away with screaming fake news… But there are still facts.
BTW just saw on local (Pacific NW) news that the 3rd body of a group of climbers killed in an avalanche was recovered this weekend. I think Mt Ranier. Two were already recovered, dead, but one was still ‘missing.’
I’m sure they were doing what they loved and it’s a big snowy mountain. This year had heavy spring snows and I’m sure they were aware of that. Most people around here who do that stuff even carry avalanche beacons for rescue but in a big avalanche the magical fairy doesn’t always arrive to rescue you. There are rescue helicopters and some great volunteer teams who love mountaineering and often do search & rescue, but sadly quite often it turns in ‘recovery.’ I admire their dedication to trying to help people and loving the sport and the mountains, but I gotta say that must get tough sometimes.
Meh.
@blaineg To expand on that, stupid billionaires (or mere millionaires) paying stupid money to take stupid chances on a stupidly designed submersible, operated by a clown that thinks safety regulations are stupid.
Spend the money being wasted on the recuse effort helping people that are in need.
@blaineg Much like treks to the top of Everest. Expensive, dangerous, serves no purpose other than self-indulgence, and damages the environment. I would not wish ill on any of the participants, but they did know the risks. I hope the debris field is evidence that the vessel imploded around the time they lost contact, as that is a better outcome than the alternatives.
@rockblossom “Every corpse on Everest was once a highly motivated person.”
@blaineg @rockblossom I am heading reports that the Navy heard a sound around just after they lost contact, sounding like an Implosion. At least that means they probably didn’t suffer and it was sudden which is a better way to go in that case is it’s not long and drawn out.
So like you said in your first comment… Meh
@blaineg @rockblossom Just the amount of fuel used in the rescue efforts must have such a ridiculous cost in money and environmental damage.
Also, I’m no engineer, but I wouldn’t think carbon fiber to be a great choice of material to expose to such extreme pressure repeatedly. It has like zero give, when you hit its limit, it just breaks.
@blaineg @Bretterson @rockblossom They use carbon fiber in some planes. Just hope they do regular safety checks because apparently it can become brittle.
@blaineg @Bretterson @gogrrl @rockblossom At 35,000’ elevation, the air pressure is about a quarter of what it is at ground level – 3.46 psi vs 14.7 psi.
At 12,000’ below sea level, the water pressure is over 5,200 psi – a huge difference in the required material strength.
@blaineg @Bretterson @gogrrl @narfcake @rockblossom Even in spacecraft the pressure difference is at most 14.7 psi.
@blaineg @Bretterson @gogrrl @narfcake @rockblossom @sammydog01 I’d agree many people don’t understand the physics involved. And yet I still loved that submarine ride at the original Anaheim Disneyland. Anybody remember that? Is the submarine ride still there?
@blaineg @Bretterson @narfcake @pmarin @rockblossom @sammydog01
I should have been more clear on the point I was making with use on airplanes. I am well aware there is a huge difference in pressure on this material on an airplane versus the Titan at those depths. The info I read was not in relation to a catastrophic failure in the air. It was referring to the material possibly becoming brittle and how that may affect “hard landings” or “plane crash survivability”. I honestly didn’t go down that rabbit hole too much…it seems to have been disproven for the most part from what I could glean. It sure wouldn’t keep me from airplane travel in any case.
@pmarin
The original Submarine Voyage was revamped to Finding Nemo.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Finding_Nemo_Submarine_Voyage
@blaineg @Bretterson @gogrrl @narfcake @pmarin @rockblossom @sammydog01 the FAA is pretty strict about testing/maintenance/reviews which are probably a bigger issue than just pressure cycles as far as accidents. Even though they are part of it.
Although some airlines still manage to mess up and not do their jobs. I have somehow gotten a channel or two worked into my suggestions that cover them. I don’t think you’ll see one related to the fuselage unless the required inspections/maintenance weren’t done properly.
NOAA and NO-ONE don’t inspect private submersibles for safety…
It’s sad they died, but I hope others settle for the burial at sea, and don’t risk more lives trying to bring the remains up.
@blaineg Futile, as an implosion at that depth - with around 375 atmospheres of pressure at the Titanic wreck - would leave nothing recognizable to retrieve. Much better to leave it in place.
Sad, but given the inherent risks (which were signed away by the passengers) and the company’s past attitude about safety regulations, am not surprised about the outcome either.
I feel bad for the kid. Especially since they’re reporting he didn’t want to go but did because it was Father’s Day. That makes me sad.
@sammydog01 Oh, that’s horrible.
@sammydog01 I’d say OK maybe, but really not that much. There are tons of things a teenager (and he was almost 20) can do with their father, or mother, or friends from college that may result in risk. truck rollovers, boats capsizing, hunting accident, bitten by poisonous spider. sorry but it happens.
In this case yes it was more ´extreme’ in terms of something that has (almost) never been done before, in a vessel of questionable reliability. But I would also say that the news likes drama and death, and promotes it heavily because guess what, it makes you watch and gives them ad revenue (and I’m not anti-media in any way but I recognize this is what it does). Right now I have the news on in the background and the main topics are about filing lawsuits and making laws to regulate expeditions (which isn’t practical anyway in international waters).
Funny thing is that last week I saw a PBS documentary on the Titanic and how a hasty congressional investigation and major newspapers accused the captain of another ship for not stopping to help the doomed Titanic passengers. And now with new evidence they figured out that ship and the wrongly-accused captain were far away on the other side of the ice field, and it was a totally different Canadian ship that was the one the survivors reported seeing in the distance. And the first captain’s career was ruined, but I bet they sold a lot of newspapers.
@pmarin You don’t think it’s sad when a teenager dies from a hunting accident or truck rollover? I do.
@sammydog01 Of course, yes I think it’s sad too. And if my 70 year old neighbor who loves to go hunting dies in a hunting accident I’d think the same thing. I think for one, I don’t know much about the relationship between this ‘young man’ (legally an adult) and his father. I’d say of course he may have been apprehensive, I would be too. A relationship between a mature son and a father is always complicated. If I could guess it would be a combination of ‘I want to please my father,’ ‘it would be F-ing cool’, and ‘I’m scared as S$#^.’ I don’t know but it would be my feeling in that situation.
But the news for a while was focusing on a ‘child’ being forced to do something and then losing their life because of it, and how we need new laws and regulations. That is where I feel the news stories were running with that as a main topic for a while. The fact is that news is sold (in the old days papers, nowadays ‘clicks’) based on creating a mix of pity and outrage. It’s very profitable.
It is truly sad, but the company had a number of complaints, even from others in the field. Today the film maker of the Movie Titanic had a comment .
It is still even experimental venture, like what Blue Horizon is doing.
I’m just glad that Josh Gates had enough sense to stay FAR away from that Rush dude. Josh was going to film a show about the Titan, but once he saw the company’s shoddy approach to safety & haphazard way of putting together a plan of action, he practically ran in the other direction. I always knew he was wicked smaht!
People died. My (and anyone’s) judgement on how they spent their money, what was going through their heads, etc, is uncalled for.
yep, risky adventures they knew they were getting into. do you know how many frozen Mt Everest climber bodies they have to haul away every year if they even find them?
I’d still want to go to space if there was a way, but not on the Bezos Space Penis. But probably would not pass medical checks. on the other hand they let William Shatner on.
but in honoring the great movie Airplane I must add this
/youtube airplane counter point let them crash
@pmarin
I think very few people outside of Nepal know how deadly that site is. This year (2023) alone there were 17 dead or missing-presumed-dead on Everest. And there will be more next year and the year after that, and we will not care or even know their names. Honestly, the only ones I might mourn are the Sherpas, who do it for money and not ego.
@pmarin @rockblossom
/youtube last week tonight everest
The other fascinating topic here is that deep sea, especially submarine rescue and salvage, has been a heavily secret venture of the US as well as Russian and now I assume other governments. This has been going on for at least 70 years and I don’t know it’s not continuing. There are many books on this after material from the 1950s-60s was declassified, but I’m sure there is a lot more.
My question when this started was many top secret vessels and technologies would the US or other governments be willing to expose? Of course there was the logistics of getting out to that place in a timely manner, which I think we now know would not have mattered anyway. But there is a long history of secrets related to deep sea capabilities.
EDIT or maybe those secrets were in those documents at Mar-a-Lago?
@mbersiam You said
True, but it’s the money subsequently spent on the search for them that seems really wasteful and out of proportion to me.
Who will foot the bill for Titan submersible’s search and rescue? The US taxpayer
https://abcnews.go.com/US/foot-bill-titan-submersibles-search-rescue-us-taxpayer/story?id=100339399
@Kyeh I notice that article didn’t say how many millions and millions this already has and will cost. If 5 people die on Everest they are basically out of luck beyond what other people already present can or can not do.
@Kyeh I’m sure there will be estimates but how much extra money that was spent will probably not be one of them. If the Coast Guard already had employees on the clock and owned the equipment those dollars were already gone. The press likes to make numbers big.
@Kidsandliz @Kyeh @sammydog01 While the response did seem a bit excessive, i think the military often treats events like this as real-world training exercises, so they’re more prepared when they lose or need to recover assets that are important to national security &/or rescue personnel, which should always be a top priority. So, i would imagine they consider that a mitigating factor when accounting for the costs.
@ircon96 @Kyeh @sammydog01 That would make sense.
@Kyeh @Kidsandliz Particularly troubling in light of this revelation according to WSJ:
A top secret military acoustic detection system designed to spot enemy submarines first heard what the U.S. Navy suspected was the Titan submersible implosion hours after the submersible began its voyage, officials involved in the search said.
The Navy began listening for the Titan almost as soon as the sub lost communications, according to a U.S. defense official. Shortly after the submersible’s disappearance Sunday, the U.S. system detected what it suspected was the sound of an implosion near the debris site discovered Thursday and reported its findings to the Coast Guard commander on site, U.S. defense officials said.
@Kyeh @macromeh That would imply they decided to turn this into a search training exercise rather than going straight to the signal (knowing everyone was dead). I did read elsewhere that that signal was used to triangulate where the sub likely was. Who knows what is really true if some of this/the tech is top secret.
@ircon96 @Kidsandliz @Kyeh Plus some good publicity. Maybe some kid now wants to join the Coast Guard because they are cool.
@Kidsandliz @Kyeh @sammydog01 @macromeh The reports I’ve been hearing are that, when word of the sound started circulating, combined with the simultaneous loss of communication & tracking, all the experts and people in the deep-sea sub community were fairly certain it was an implosion, but because of the nature of the technology, it can never be 100% definitive.
@ircon96 @Kidsandliz @Kyeh @macromeh @sammydog01 Yes catastrophic implosions (is there any other kind?) have been well-known and understood for years (a century or so) in that community, so I’m sure it was like ‘yup, that was it.’ And I don’t think any submariner doesn’t know this is a possibility. At least mercifully it’s likely to be very quick.
The long history of secret deep ocean exploration (mainly for the purpose of retrieving downed US and Russian submarines) ties to the Titanic.
https://www.nationalgeographic.co.uk/history-and-civilisation/2018/11/titanic-was-found-during-secret-cold-war-navy-mission
Also previous to this, look up the Glomar Explorer. Supposedly built for ocean mineral exploration but was really a secret military operation to retrieve a submarine.
So there is often a “cover story” and years later as things are declassified or info leaks out, we learn cool history. Which is why I wondered how much current deep-sea secret tech would be exposed in this, given several countries and every news channel in the world covering it.
@pmarin thinking about it, would not be surprised if there were Russian or Chinese subs in the area just watching what equipment we deployed. Though they can’t go that deep either as far as I know. But enough to learn stuff.
I think all the search vessels were US, Canada, France, and as they are close allies it is possible that extra information was shared with them at some point.
If there were ‘enemy’ subs in the area very possibly the US would have known about it. I worked with a guy that was a ‘sonarman’ on a Navy sub (1970s-early 80s). He said ‘we would know where they were, they would know where we were.’ And of course this was before whatever secret underwater sensor network might exist now that was apparently partially revealed this week.
@pmarin The SOSUS system has been in use, and publicly known for decades. Which would imply there is a much better version that’s still secret.
https://www.wikiwand.com/en/SOSUS
@pmarin It would not surprise me to hear that the Titan was being watched/listened from the beginning of the dive. Seems like it would be a good training and testing opportunity. I read somewhere that the search was needed to find proof that could be shown beyond “we heard it implode”. With the international audience and none military people involved steps needed to be documented.
Implosion test of a steel sphere.
https://streamable.com/mts5db
If I’m being honest… I just don’t… care? It shouldn’t even be real news. Other than people turned it into news because some wealthy people died in a way they could make sound interesting and fill their 24/7 news cycle for a few days with some made up suspense when everyone knew they were dead.
And other people turned the search into a circus.
5 people died doing something dangerous is not a world wide headline. It’s barely even noteworthy in the death statistics. So… IDK…
@unksol it’s newsworthy only while it’s a Schrodinger’s cat situation. Same reason missing planes get lots of news until the fate is determined.
@medz with an airliner there’s at least some chance that they managed to ditch and there are survivors in a raft or something. Not much but some. And investigations into what happened generally improve airline safety/correct defects/prevent future accidents/help restore public faith/punish bad actors. The why actually matters there. I don’t really pay any attention to those on the news either though.
I’m more of a this happened/why it happened/what are we doing about it person. The whole constant public news watch/wild speculating I just don’t get.
@medz @unksol
Pretty much describes almost ALL the news coverage, really!
@Kyeh @medz @unksol
/youtube don henley dirty laundry 2005
@Kyeh @medz @unksol
Hmm, posted this but not sure what youtube will dig up – never seen the live version.
The key lyric is “it’s interesting when people die; we love dirty laundry” and also talks about plane crashes and scandals the main goal of news outlets (as I said earlier, used to be newspapers, then TV, now it’s internet clicks). The key is making something provocative, tragic, outraging. Sometimes the outrage has to be manufactured, but they’ve become very good at manufacturing that. Probably the last thing we actually manufacture in this country.
@Kyeh @medz @pmarin I don’t know how to fix the news. Some are worse than others. There’s some that are just straight up propaganda but it’s all influenced.
I mostly read it because at least then, just based on the title and the source, I can decide if it’s worth reading. Clickbait titles/dishonest outlets/the hourly sub report saying the same thing… can be avoided.
Granted I’m still reading a selection of free articles from journalists not being paid that a bot picked to show me.
And I’m picking what interests me. There’s a metric ton of bias built in. Some intentional some not. In what we consider the news these days
Probably how a certain someone gets away with screaming fake news… But there are still facts.
Rich people go squish.
@DrunkCat I feel evil for laughing at this, but I did.
BTW just saw on local (Pacific NW) news that the 3rd body of a group of climbers killed in an avalanche was recovered this weekend. I think Mt Ranier. Two were already recovered, dead, but one was still ‘missing.’
I’m sure they were doing what they loved and it’s a big snowy mountain. This year had heavy spring snows and I’m sure they were aware of that. Most people around here who do that stuff even carry avalanche beacons for rescue but in a big avalanche the magical fairy doesn’t always arrive to rescue you. There are rescue helicopters and some great volunteer teams who love mountaineering and often do search & rescue, but sadly quite often it turns in ‘recovery.’ I admire their dedication to trying to help people and loving the sport and the mountains, but I gotta say that must get tough sometimes.