4-10-20 Judgement day delayed
94-10-20
Well, the fear of COVID 19 has ground the legal process to a halt. Courts are closed, prisoners are being released from jail to relieve some overcrowding, Grand juries can’t meet.
SHMBO was scheduled for a second session of grand jury duty at the end of March, only to have it cancelled by the virus since they can’t assemble that many folks in one place at one time.
How about you… have you ever been on a jury? Grand Jury?
Has the stay at home order affected any legal proceedings you are involved in?
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I’ve been on a jury once. Civil case involving a rear end collision by a person driving a commercial truck (not a semi). Case settled out of court on the second day.
Courts are closed other than DV cases. Everything is delayed. Not much different than for a continuance.
This is going to be interesting with cases involving the statute of limitations.
Oklahoma’s supreme court issued an edict that these cases can be extended 6 months.
Can they though really? Since the statute of limitations is set by the legislative branch?
Off to the courthouse we will go, I imagine.
@therealjrn I think the court will take the position that the days the courts are closed to the public do not count towards a statute of limitations. Not much different than force majeure instances like Cali earthquakes, Katrina, Sandy, etc.
Wait, it was Judgment Day and I missed it because of the virus? That’s probably a good thing for me; I’ve still got a ton to work on.
I was on a jury for drunk driving case in Federal (!) court once. The government had the burden of proving three facts beyond reasonable doubt:
To speed things along, both sides stipulated to item #1.
After more than 5 hours of witness testimony, well… Spoiler alert: We, twelve good jurors and true, needed less than 10 minutes to return a Not Guilty verdict.
Needing to prove only two things, with all the power and might the U.S. Government could bring to bear, the U.S. Attorney failed to convict because:
a) They had refused (despite the accused’s repeated requests to do so) to administer a breathalyzer test, and
b) They didn’t even claim the accused was in the car; just that he had been “loitering in the vicinity of the vehicle” (which the accused admitted).
What a massive waste of time and taxpayers’ money. I did, however, get to admire the new, multi-multi-million-dollar Federal courthouse, all encased in marble and walnut, from within.
“Of the people, for the people, and by the people” my ass. I lost a lot of respect for my government that day.
Come the revolution, count me in.
The first time I was seated for a jury it was for a weapons charge. The defendant was accused of having in his possession, a firearm. Which is a no no for a convicted felon.
The second time I was seated for a jury was a civil trial. For a traffic accident. Immediately after opening comments, the two atty approached the bench and then we were escorted out. I asked the bailiff what was going on and he said that one of the attorneys must have decided to try harder to settle out of court.
The third time I was seated for a jury, I ended up being the jury foreman. For a murder trial. It was awful. Truly awful. We had to see autopsy photos. Listen to the testimony. Watch video. It was disturbing and at the end of it all the state provided counseling for the jurors.
Stoned high school kids who had no business doing what they were doing, directly caused the death of a three year old girl.
After that I moved to a different county with a MUCH lower population density and I have never again been summoned.
In the past I was usually tossed from the jury pool because as an EMT I knew many of the officers/deputies. My last case (after I went full time as a nurse and quitting running with the ambulance company) I was not only selected, but then got voted to be the foreman. Guess that will teach me to show up in a dress shirt!
Sexual abuse case that was a PITA due to the legal constraints we were placed under…
I have never served jury duty. I have, however, received summons twice. The 1st time I was attending college out-of-state and didn’t have a vehicle. The 2nd time I was summoned by a neighboring county. I was excused both times.
☆My town is in 3 counties. It also isn’t laid out straight north-south east-west. My house which is in the “north” part of town is actually in the SE county of the 3 counties. All 3 come together about 2 blocks from my house. The county line (between my county and the one I was mistakenly called to jury duty in) runs through a house on the next block. Also, I have renewed my driver’s license at the county courthouse of the “wrong” county.
@msklzannie man that’s crazy. I thought our town was weird enough for being in 2 counties, though it is easier to determine since a river divides it.
Our city hall is in one county, but both counties have a satellite office for the probate judge there one day a week (different days) so you can do car tags etc. there. One of them even does driver’s licenses so you can do that there as well since that is a state thing, not a county thing.
@chienfou We’re a river town too, but alongside the river. There used to be a house in the 3rd county, but the city bought it and tore it down due to repeated flooding.
I’ve been a defendant once. My son’s dog (a little Boston terrier mix) kept getting out of the yard and apparently terrorized the neighbors. We took pains to try to keep him in the backyard, but he still managed to escape.
One neighbor called him a pit bull (I’ll post a picture later) and said she had to go after him with a 2x4 to protect herself because he was vicious. This dog is only vicious if you are a lawnmower.
Anyway he kept getting out and animal control was called multiple times. One time it was too many and they ordered that we had to take the dog to the pound or else (because they could never catch him).
We took him to the pound. I was given a court date and we were told that the judge could basically do whatever he wanted in this case including euthanasia, but it depended also on what the charge was. The neighbor wanted him taken in as vicious which would likely carry the death penalty, but they wouldn’t file the complaint themselves. Animal control filed the complaint as nuisance dog (I’m pretty sure that’s right) because they never saw him being vicious.
We took it seriously. We invested in an electric fence and had plans to replace part of the real fence that was horribly dilapidated.
I made light of it saying my dog was in “dog jail” and I had to go to “dog court”. Boy was I wrong. It was real court. Apparently our little suburb takes things very seriously.
So the day for court arrived. I prepared by getting a printout for the dog from the pound (where we got him) showing we had the dog for years and that us being unable to keep him in the yard was a recent problem. We printed out his vet records to show he had his shots and that he was scared for. We printed out pictures of the electric fence to show we were prepared to do what it took to keep him in.
The first case heard that day let me know how wrong I had been to make light of the situation. It was gun charges and drugs at a traffic stop.
The animal control officers showed up in court and spoke. They made sure the judge knew he was never showed signs of being vicious around them. They also reported he was well behaved in the pound.
The prosecutor and judge took all of this into account. They decided to change the charge from a nuisance dog to one At Large (a lesser offense).
We were ordered to pay court fees and impound fees and the dog was released to us with the order that if he gets out again in six months that I (ME!) would go to jail for contempt of court. The cost was somewhere upwards of $300.
When we left the clerk printed a summons to come back to court after that six months. We were confused because the judge had said nothing about it.
I showed up for my court date and I was not on the docket. The clerk looked me up and put me on it. I appeared once more before the judge and reported that the dog had been staying in the yard (at least mostly as he did sneak out the front door at least once - but he was brought back in before being reported). After that I was free to go.
A quick note about the city people. The animal control officers were very nice. They explained everything and did what they could to make sure that we could get the dog back. The prosecution and judge were both just (I don’t believe in fair).
TLDR: Dog got impounded and I had to go to court to get him back.
Here is the vicious pit bull…
@jst1ofknd Boy… does that saga bring back memories.
About 40 yrs ago we lived in Int’l Fall MN on the Canadian border. At that time going back and forth was no biggie, and come summer time there was a Buffalo festival (I think that was what it was?) that was held in Canada someplace not too far from Fort Frances (the city across the river from IF).
We packed up a picnic, grabbed the dog and some blankets and headed to the festival. Dog was a mixed german shepherd/collie and cream colored, generally a very mellow dog and never any problem for us. We had her on a lead attached to a tree when we went to go get something to eat (buffalo burgers) from one of the vendors, and when we came back there was a ring of folks about 10 meters away from our blanket and picnic basket. As we walked up and thru the ring of people, the dog came running up to us, tail wagging and with her best “see what a good job I did” grin. Turns out she had broken her chain lead and was holding everyone at bay that came anywhere near “her people’s” shit. She would sit on the blanket and then charge anybody that came within about 20 ft of our stuff, then retire back to her turf.We put her on her leash, and apologized to the crowd if she had scared anyone. She had not bitten anyone, but there was a definite vibe that they felt she would have. A RCMP officer (think, “Duddly DoRight” ) came up and cited us for ‘dog at large’.
Flash forward a couple of months to the court date. We show up at the Canadian court and “Holy Crap” the judge and prosecutor are wearing freaking powdered wigs!
YES, that’s right POWDERED F’in WIGS… in 1982. It looks like the continental congress in there…
We were defending ourselves, and the proceedings were very formal, but ultimately we were convicted of ‘dog at large’ and fined $200 CAD (about $150 US at the time). The RCMP dude was super apologetic when he learned the amount of the fine since the dog hadn’t actually hurt anyone… “I won’t have charged you if I’d known, eh…”
TL:DR Canadian courts are a trip!
The first time, I was called to report for jury duty when I was 9 months pregnant, and I had to present my pregnant self to get excused. The next time, it was a Federal District court case involving international cargo, and I wound up as foreperson. It went on for two solid weeks, we returned verdicts for both the suit and countersuit, and both sides were equally dissatisfied. We got reconvened to clarify stuff, and I’d kept my notes, so that took another day. I agree, show up in office clothes and you will get selected.
Even though I’ve been on the rolls in this county since my teens, I have only been summoned for jury duty once. I was among those selected for the first case on the docket and went directly from the selection process into the trial. One of the most unpleasant weeks of my life - it was a father-daughter molestation case. The victim was 15 and in the same high school class as my daughter. We had to sit through hours of testimony about forensic evidence of semen-stained blankets and the victim’s recollections of horrible incidents up to and including the one that lead to the arrest. But it really all came down to he-said-she-said and the defendant’s (probably court appointed) attorney just kind of phoned it in. We convicted on all counts.
As close as I got was being part of a pool of 600 people that got summonsed for 3 cases. My case plead out, another waived jury trial. The third made good progress seating jurors, so the rest of us got sent sent home by noon. At least someone brought cards and we spent the morning playing euchre. That was 20 years ago. Haven’t had even a summons since. Which I’m sure will change because I’m writing this.
I wouldn’t mind serving on a jury (hopefully not sequestered or for weeks/months), but have not been selected so far.
Actually given how corrupt crook county IL is and how many bought and paid for judges there are that can’t be gotten rid of (the city unions and ward bosses go out of their way to tell their members to vote to retain all judges) I’m not sure it really matters that much here.
I get summonsed every 2 years or so, and almost every time its to the shithole southside chicago court where they have to have armed guards or police walk jurors to and from the train station.
I live 1/4 mile from the northern edge of the county. Been to the downtown federal court twice, but to 26th and california nearly a dozen times; never sent to a suburban court. They send the city dwellers without cars to the suburban courts so they get to take trains and transfer to busses to get there.
Talk about a pain in the ass. crook county illannoy delights in such things, I am convinced.