@zippyus So, if the tax goes up, the service you got is worth more?
I never include the tax when figuring a tip. And the service had better be more than adequate for me to leave one at all. I know, I’m something of a cheapskate – but I retired from teaching after more than 30 years, and had been given tips maybe thrice, and that’s hard work also. (Those tips were “gifts” from foreign students – Asian or Arabic, who told me that was customary in their place; seemed more like attempted bribery to me, after the final exam but before grades came out.)
@phendrick@zippyus The difference between getting tipped for being a salaried employee (teacher) and getting tipped for hourly work that is only paid about 1/3 of the amount of minimum wage is quite large. Servers make less than $5 per hour and depend on tips to make up the difference. Not leaving a tip isn’t being a cheapskate—it’s being unfeeling and callous.
Excerpt from phoenixnewtimes.com article about tipping:
With the rare exception of truly offensive service, there is a social contract that exists between the server and the public that the only way they can have a livable wage is to receive tips. You do not need to tip at a counter-service place that does not provide post-sale service. It is never okay not to tip.
@Gypsigirl213@phendrick@zippyus Thank you Gypsigirl!! I was a server for years during college, and people that don’t tip should not be allowed to eat out. In GA, a server makes around $2.15/hr. and automatically taxed 10% on every credit card charge since the IRS assumes that’s the minimum a customer will tip. Zero tip or leaving less than 10% means the server is paying the IRS to wait on you.
@msqaf00@phendrick@zippyus Wow—I didn’t know that about the tax—that’s utterly disgusting. It boggles my mind how people who already get paid next to nothing are instantly robbed by the IRS. I waited tables for a minute when I was 18, but I wasn’t properly trained, so I was terrible at it and it was an awful experience. That’s how I know how hard that job is. Even if I never had the experience, I would never not tip (abominable service aside) because etiquette.
Well, servers are not losing a lot because of my tip policy. For one thing, because of my current financial situation, it’s been most of a year since I ate at a place where tips were a thing. Before that, I did make sure to tip when the service was, as I said, adequate. I know the job is hectic, and I didn’t usually blame the server for a mistake in the order, if they made an effort to correct it. But I would not tip a rude server. This is a college community and most wait staff are college. (Funny thing, it seems to me that college students are generally not very good tippers, at least at the non-five-star restaurants I would frequent. And at fast food places with no tipping, I didn’t often see students put money into tip jars at the counter, with students working behind the counter.) I believed in supporting their efforts. When I ate, I usually paid cash, and the same for tips. I very seldom did not tip at least 15% on the restaurant charge.
@msquf00 Is that just a Georgia thing? I have talked with students about waiting and their tips, and no one ever mentioned this automatic tax on credit charges to me, I think they might have. Does the restaurant have to report credit charges accepted for each employee? I also think, but am not sure, that in doing their tax return, they could report their actual income and get the difference back in a refund from their withholding.
@Gypsigirl213@haydesigner I guess that’s me – I also kick blind beggars to the curb and won’t give my dog any of that onion soup she keeps begging me for. (I’ll have to stop working at Habitat for Humanity, so I don’t ruin my reputation.)
Unfeeling and calloused – have you been observing my hands and feet?
The reason the employers total up tips is to make sure they’re still paying their tipped staff minimum wage. They don’t give a flying fuck about the tipped staff’s taxes. The executives don’t want to go to federal prison for wage theft since we outlawed owning people outright some 150 years ago.
Percentages for this are bullshit. Bringing me something cheap takes just as much effort as bringing me something expensive. I just go with a couple bucks usually, for the hourish I was there, and try to do so in cash if possible.
@haydesigner Why not tip jars? There’s a teeny taco place (formerly a taco truck, but they were able to open a little restaurant!) where when I pick up an order I always leave a couple of bucks in the tip jar.
@Gypsigirl213@haydesigner Those folks are getting paid at least minimum wage- table servers aren’t. I put money in tip jars sometimes, especially if it’s at a concert and the weather is terrible. But I don’t feel the need to.
Everyone is guaranteed minimum wage, if base wage + tips are less than minimum wage, the restaurant is responsible for making up the difference to ensure they do make minimum wage.
My 20% is pretax. I’ve noticed a lot of places that put helpful tip calculations on the receipt include tax. Or better yet, don’t include tax on the first itemized copy but then change to include it on the credit card one you must sign.
Occasionally the tip is higher for good service. Or because it includes the amount of anything that is comped. Or lower for terrible service.
Back in my early 20’s we had service so awful at a chain restaurant that my tip was “stay in school, don’t do drugs, call 1-800-COLLECT, and pay attention to your tables” but I felt pretty bad about that afterward. That girl probably didn’t last long in that career field if she was consistently that terrible, though.
@ZeroCharisma For real though, I usually tip way higher than 20%. I don’t do restaurants much, and when I do it’s usually just coffee - no reason the server should get screwed because I ordered the cheapest thing on the menu.
I believe the entire system of tipping is fundamentally flawed and shouldn’t exist, and as a result I actively avoid eating in establishments where tipping is customary. It is the employer’s responsibility, not the customer’s, to properly pay their staff.
I also will not tip in places where no additional service was provided (e.g. carry-out orders or fast food), unless the particular staff were very exceptional. (I believe in rewarding kindness)
@PooltoyWolf I agree that tipping system is flawed and shouldn’t exist. However, there are too many restaurants that I love to just not patronize them.
I do know a few individuals that feel the need to protest the system by just refusing to tip ever, insisting it’s the “only way to bring about a change to the system”. They realize they are just sticking it to a single innocent individual who is paid less than minimum wage and has no say in the matter, but rationalize it by throwing out a bunch of “taking a stand” or “taking the first step” garbage, thinking they are Rosa Parks.
They aren’t accomplishing anything except looking like a d-bag.
@DrWorm@PooltoyWolf Agreed. Not tipping is awful, uncaring, and atrocious as it does only punish the individual and does nothing to change the system. The system has to be changed by laws or by the restaurants themselves, but the restaurants have no incentive to change, which is why laws are more likely to enact change. Contact lawmakers and demand change, that’s only way to get it done.
And for me, it’s usually more than 20%. Depends on the service and how long I stay (because always increase your tip if you’re lingering and preventing servers from turn over as it reduces their income).
Pretty often it’s 20% rounded up to the nearest dollar or $5. Sometimes a bit less than 20% because I like the number better (say I ordered a fancy pizza that cost 1.33x the usual amount? Something like that maybe.)
What drives me nuts is that tips aren’t just for waiters. There’s a whole mysterious catalog of “Wait was I supposed to have tipped there? Am I a cheapskate for my ignorance?”
Sometimes I buy a carryout pizza with a credit card, and then they print out a receipt with a tip line, and I fill it out because the piece of paper seems to be demanding extra money, but I am pretty sure my payment is not adjusted.
I am pretty sure you’re supposed to tip hotel maids … was it every night? With some kind of special note? There’s all this stupid nonsense I’m supposed to know about that. It makes even less sense than wait staff.
@InnocuousFarmer i usually google if i’m not sure. for example, we never travel so we never stay in hotels, but awhile back we had occasion to stay in a bunch. had to google about housekeeping. i generally don’t want or need it, but when they did come we left a tip for that day, because the staff rotates. so if you stay a week and only tip on friday, then one person might get a real nice tip for one day and everyone else got nothing. have also had to google for valets, stylists, tattoo artists, furniture delivery guys, you name it. it’s confusing out there and i wish i had more money to give away.
20% always, but rounded up to the next whole dollar or more, and more for above and beyond service. except twice in my entire life when the service was just THAT BAD. (and i still tipped just not 20%.)
We usually tip around $2.50 per person we are paying for rounded to the next dollar and adjust based on service. If it is a particularly fancy place or a particularly complex order, we adjust accordingly but we never adjust downward for a cheap restaurant. That means for a really cheap meal we will sometimes tip close to 75% but the wait staff didn’t work any less hard so I fail to see why they don’t deserve to make just as much as at a Chillis or something.
Usually 20-25% PRE-TAX to the nearest dollar, although will go lower for very poor service. It would have to be very bad to go below 15%. I try to tip a little more for smaller bills, especially if the service was superb!
I despise the receipts that have suggested amounts, as they’re usually calculated AFTER tax. Tip is ALWAYS off of pre-tax!
Don’t usually tip for takeout orders, as, to me, no extra service was rendered beyond what I ordered. In my opinion, tip is for service rendered for something I could have done myself (get the food to my table, carry my own luggage, park my car) that someone else put in the effort to do for me (obviously, I don’t have a choice in restaurants).
It depends… At a coffee shop (fancy coffee, not just drip) and bars, I tip $1/drink…Unless I am running a tab, then 20%+. At restaurants usually I round up the pre-tax amount to make he nearest $10 and do 20% of that - more for exceptional service… But, if I received a discount or free item/drink (coupon or reward or the like) I usually add half the cost of the free item to my standard tip amount.
I get a drip coffee refill every morning from the same shop. It comes to $1.39, I hand them 2 $1 bills and toss the 61¢ in the jar.
Restaurants I usually tip 20%. Bars $1 per drink. Hotel maid, $5 bucks a night. Taxi, depends on the fare, but somewhere between $5-10.
I usually tip around 20%, give or take. It’s usually a factor of rounding to the nearest dollar/$5 amount. Great service gets more, bad service(not kitchen related) usually gets less.
If they aren’t bringing the food to me, refilling drinks, etc, then I’m not tipping. The tip jar or the “please add percentage to your bill when you order at the counter” is BS. (Reports I saw showed many companies simply pocket the “tip at counter” as they have no obligation to give that to employees, and the tip concept drives people to pay more when they don’t have to).
For delivery drivers, I usually shoot for $5. They get a usual salary, but they do have to drive/wear/tear on vehicle, so I factor that into the drive. That’ll end up being less than 20% there, but I don’t tend to go crazy with deliveries anyway, so overall tends to be pretty low.
@spitfire6006006 Every one I’ve talked to(granted not many) were paid employees. Then there’s the adverts for hiring at pizza places and the like, giving an hourly rate plus tips. But then, I actively use the services that actually hire their employees for delivery, vs view them as contractors, so that might be a difference there.
For waitstaff, my starting point is 20%. If I know I’ve left a mess/kept the person busy, it’ll be more. Waxers get at least $5, even if service is less than $25. Food delivery, 20-25%, depending on how screwed I think they’re getting by their contracted employer. 20% or more for takeout. A lot of those times ToGo orders require logistics and thoughtfulness people dismiss far too easily.
Tipping varies based on quality of food/service, total bill, oddball amounts. I will usually tip well over 15%, round to the nearest dollar etc. depending on the above factors. Most times it’s on my CC for the FF miles or rewards back on restaurant purchases.
BTW tips are based on the value of the meal (BOGO tip should be on the cost if you didn’t get the BOBO for instance…)
30+% because I serve tables and I know it really makes your day and makes up for the horrible garbage people that leave 10% or less and don’t understand that servers TIP OUT OTHER STAFF MEMBERS based on their sales, usually 3-4%, so if you leave $4 on $100 because you feel like that server had 4 other tables and you can’t justify them making more than you make working at the Walgreen’s register, that server either broke even or lost money on the hour and a half of extra ranch they just wasted on you… kthxbaiiiii
@mavgrad13 I don’t think that’s typical. In fact, many states do not allow tips to go to back of the house employees. It would probably be better if the tip was split between everyone who made that table’s meals, but I don’t think it’s in any way universal or even common. Of course, I always do at least 18% even for bad service except for carryout/takeout counters.
You’re eating at a restaurant, but have to leave quickly. Maybe you’re in an airport and need to catch your flight. It doesn’t matter.
You get your check and see that it’s wrong. You got charged for an extra entree you didn’t order. You don’t have time to get the bill corrected.
What do you do? Pay the full check but no tip? Put cash on the table to cover what your check should have been plus a tip and just leave? Pay the full check plus tip?
For unremarkable service, I tip 20% after tax; if the service is bad, I’ll tip 20% before tax.
The difference is, like, pennies and I’m sure the server doesn’t notice either way, but it makes me feel like I’m at least making some kind of statement.
Rarely have I ever had service so remarkably bad that I’ve tipped less than 20%. I’m sure it’s happened a couple of times though, and I probably just rounded down from 20% or something like that.
I’m much more likely to tip extra for better-than-average service than to tip less for marginally bad service.
I’m an easy customer, I don’t usually complain or make special requests.
My father is a horrible customer - always giving special instructions and complaining about things. If we’re dining together and I’m paying, I definitely toss the server a noticeable extra amount along with a few looks that silently say, “I know. I’m sorry.”
It’s rare that I go somewhere often enough that I get to know a server and get personalized service, but there was one place I used to go to most Sundays for brunch, and sit at the bar. It was a busy place and the bar tender hustled her ass off, but still went out of her way to be friendly and get to know me a bit.
After a few visits, she stopped charging me for the over-priced iced tea I always ordered, and refilled it without my asking.
I would tip her an extra $5 on top of the 20% (for a $20ish meal, IIRC).
The tip line on the c.c. receipt for take-out/counter service makes me uncomfortable. lol
(No, I’m not tipping for that.)
@kazriko I have always thought of it based on pre-tax, but often do the math based on post-tax and figure then it is a little more. I usually round up a little. I can only speak to my experience, but 30 years ago we had to minimally claim a percentage of our subtotals (pre-tax). And when we had larger parties, we built-in the tip based on that as well. I have noticed that some restaurants put tip calculations at the bottom of their receipts and the are clearly based on the total (including tax).
@kazriko … it probably depends on the design of the receipt. Never thought about it that I can recall. Probably post-tax? 0.06*.2 is 0.012, and I don’t usually tip to the penny. So now that I think about it, both.
@InnocuousFarmer So about a 1.2% difference in your case, 1.6% in mine, so it would have to be a fairly large bill before it made a $1 difference, since I already round up to the nearest dollar on that.
@PlutoIsAPlanet This is how it should be IMHO. Getting rid of tipping altogether would very likely hurt great service since the staff’s pay would be the same regardless of their quality of service or hustle (notice this without fail overseas). Base pay should be covered commensurate with the job requirements and then we can tip for above-average service.
@jester747@PlutoIsAPlanet IDK I have had very few issues when traveling abroad, maybe I have been lucky - or you have been unlucky lol. Is the service better when I tip anyway (ie. hotel), of course! That said I have never really had issues at restaurants. Some waiters(waitresses) are better than others, but generally acceptable.
@PlutoIsAPlanet There’s a handful of restaurants in the US who have gotten rid of tipping, and many more that have tried it, very few of them keep that system. A very recent freakanomics podcast discussed it.
Rather new-ish pet-peeve of mine are these counter service places where you pay upfront upon ordering, typically with a touchscreen and then you get those silly HUGE guilt-trip buttons asking for a tip amount (that everyone in line behind you can see). Huh??? I don’t even have my empty self-service soda cup yet, have no idea if you will actually hold the pickles, or if the chicken will have a rusty nail in it or not… yet I have to figure out how much to tip!!! These places should just have an email address for tipping via Venmo, Google Pay or something, AFTER we actually get some service.
@jester747 I don’t ever provide tips for carry-out/takeout/counter service, because the only thing I’m paying for in such instances is the food itself and its preparation. Nobody waited on me at a table, etc., so why should I pay any extra?
We millennials need to get paid more than the crap wages these places offer (and that are run by your fellow boomers, so blame them for this situation). So we innovated and disrupted our way to a solution.
Now take a selfie for your Instagram showing how you tipped the food customization technicians more than the other losers behind you in line so you don’t break your streak and it will go viral.
Also, why didn’t you use your influencer card to get a discount to make up for the tip?
A Boomer can be an IG influencer??? What’s next a Yankee Cajun (well, besides Ron Guidry!) ?? Dividing by zero??
Seriously though, true innovation would be as was posted above… Pay the staff well and have tipping be optional (not eliminated) and also not requested prior to service with no way to add more later. With a digital wallet type option the cashless-society conundrum gets resolved and we can tip appropriately without guessing.
Thing is, a few restaurants around here have tried to take matters into their own hands, paying well and specifying that tips are optional (with slightly higher pricing of course) and folks just can’t wrap their minds around it… “why is your courtbouillon 11 bucks when it’s 10 down the street! Pffft!”… restaurateurs should do it together at least regionally so folks get educated. Single shops doing it unfairly hurts the good guy.
Single shops doing it unfairly hurts the good guy.
And foisting “right to (not) work” and busting unions is how Walmart put all of those small-town single shops out of business. And sign up the part-time non-union anti-collective bargaining workforce for government poverty and social welfare programs to shift those costs onto the taxpayers.
Tipping-based industries and low minimum wage rates are corporate socialism. Privatize the profits to the shareholders, socialize the costs to the taxpayers, the public, and the environment.