COVID hits whole family
38hi, it’s me, it’s my family.
All 3 of my kids, my husband, and I. we all had it. Now that we’re all mostly out of the woods I feel ok posting about it. I feel like it will take a while for my husband to heal from it because he has other complicating health issues. I’m still only running at about 75%. I’m working from home and by the time I clock out I am wiped out.
What helped/did not help:
I am fully vaccinated, it hit me hard and I felt awful.
I take vitamins daily including D3, zinc, and multivitamin. I stopped taking them when I first got sick because I felt so awful. I did start taking them again after my visit to the hospital.
My husband and I both got monocolonal antibodies and they did help.
We were taking tylenol and ibuprofen for the fevers, but it didn’t really seem to help much.
On the fever: It was the weirdest fever I’ve ever experienced (and I’ve had many fevers over the course of my life, including being packed in ice from a high fever when I was in 3rd grade). It was a roller coaster. I felt worse when my fever was “mid-range” between 101 and 102.5. I felt delirious when it was above that. I didn’t even realize I was running a fever when it was 100-101.4 by the 3rd day. I would have chills and sweats. It felt worse at night.
I’m willing to answer questions if you have any.
- 17 comments, 48 replies
- Comment
I am glad everyone is doing well. I have said I would not wish it on anyone. I am a long hauler.
I got mine right when shit-hit-the fan. Service industry. Hooray. So there were no antibodies, no vaccines, nothing. Just basically: hope you don’t die you table-waiting serf.
I wonder if I wouldn’t still have a persistent cough when I wake and the memory fog had antibodies available to me. But, I can’t go back in time. However, it is bonkers to me you got tested that many times. I lost my PCP because I got infuriated that she wouldn’t order another test for me after I was positive, quarantined, and wanted to return to my family safely. “The reagents are in short supply! You would just show up positive still anyway.”
And now people get them boarding planes, multiple times, it is crazy to me. Oh well. (Cue Beyonce: Survivor)
@KNmeh7 If you have access to Sam’s Club, they’re selling DIY Binax test kits now. I keep a kit around just in case. The kits are probably available elsewhere by now, too.
@werehatrack I understand how rapidly the technology and medicine have ramped up since I had it 400+ days ago. After half of the staff came up with all the symptoms we shut down (it was a small place, it helped the owner got it). All went to get the terrible nose test.
I came up negative. My girlfriend was positive. Needless to say within a few days I got the tell-tale symptoms. So, my ex-PCP ordered a test and it was definitely the fancy meant for executives test. I actually borrowed my neighbors Land Rover to drive there, and thank god, the only cars in the line were luxury. Would’ve looked out of place with my 15 year old chevy.
I was bracing the wheel ready for it again, and the nurse was: “you are really nervous: if you have ever had a strept test it is the same.”
Me: “What? Not the nose?” Okay.
So, I get that test was not meant for people like me, but to not order another because… yea. That one came up positive, of course.
@KNmeh7
Yeah, if you read SF, there’s a scene in the book “Diplomatic Immunity” where the main character isn’t yet sure if he’s caught something nasty, and the doc comes back and says “Well, we won’t have to retest, it came up right away.” Good news is, no retest needed. Bad news is, that’s because this one is already positive. Last year, at that time in the plague cycle, it was damn sure dire news indeed.
@KNmeh7
That is accurate - you would have shown up positive for weeks or months afterwards. Can’t tell by a covid test, if you already tested positive, whether or not it is safe to go back to work, family…
The only group they re-test for that is those who have been exposed, test negative, have to stay home for however long they are doing it these days, and then still test neg to go back to work (eg they didn’t come down with it after being exposed). If they then test pos on the second test, I think the current “rules” for asymptomatic people is 10 days after testing pos before you can escape quarantine.
If you liked your previous PCP better than the one now, maybe think about going back as what she said was accurate.
Ouch. Obviously not fun.
I think I may have had a mild case during early days (before there were cases reported in my state, before masking became a “thing” outside the medical communities, before any talk of shutdowns). Feb 2020.
I’d had a flu shot but i may have gotten a flu variant, of course.
I wasn’t that sick in healthcare terms. No fever At the time I thought I prob had a weird cold.
Just the most damned awful fatigue and headaches. The headaches felt like a constant vise grip around my head. And things smelled weird. All I wanted to do was sleep. When I want sleep I just wanted to lie around.
I did have masks, had previously gotten some from a nurse.
So I avoided public places, and when I did go indoors at a gas station or similar, I put on the mask and made excuses that I was sometimes around health-frail persons.
Then it lifted. But slowly. The fatigue got much better but took a year to go away and sometimes still returns. Shortness of breath comes and goes, it’s now rare.
For about 3 months afterwards I got a vise-grip headache for some hours every afternoon. Hated those. Sometimes still get them.
I never got antibody tested. At the time the only way I knew of to get tested was at the ER. I didn’t want to do that. They were busy enough without me.
By the time testing centers existed, it was long past.
Later on, once symptoms were minor or gone, I just didn’t want to bother with antibody testing. Perhaps I should. Dont know.
I’ve now been vaxxed 3 times.
I’ve received no treatment. Didn’t see the point, given my symptoms.
But I think medical interventions are now much improved?
When did you all first get symptoms? Still doing treatments? Are any of you recovered yet?
@f00l Interesting. Back in late November 2019 before it was supposed to have hit the US I went to the ER. I was turning blue from low oxygen. I was so tired and felt like I was slowly dying. They thought for sure I had the flu but tested negative. They took chest xrays and said I may have had walking pnemonia but the xray couldn’t confirm.
It took me about 6 weeks to start breathing normally and feel good again. Then everything hit the USA like a storm. I give blood regularly so when the red cross started anitbody testing about 6 months after I was sick it came back negative but that doesn’t really mean anything to me. I know there were a lot of people getting mysteriously and dangerously ill October-December 2019.
to answer your questions:
We have the option of the monoclonal antibodies as an intervention now which is shown to 85% efficacy in non-vaccinated individuals. It is a one-time IV infusion.
There may be some other treatment options depending on severity of symptoms.
My kids started with their symptoms on Thursday and Friday. My husband’s symptoms showed up on Saturday. We were all tested that Sunday. My test came back negative, one was inconclusive, and 3 were positive. I started with symptoms that Tuesday. I finally went to the hospital on Friday and was tested again and received treatment. My husband went in the day after me (so he had been having symptoms for a week at the time he received treatment).
My kids are fully recovered - and have been for several days. They were so bored in quarantine they were doing chores and even pulled out Christmas decorations and put up the tree just to do something.
We luckily have some amazing friends who were able to bring dinner to my kids when I was too sick to move… and we had our neighbor farmer come check on the goats too
@mbersiam
Good on ya for having been vaxed, the statistics would say that it may have kept you out of the ICU. It sounds like you were in pretty much of an optimal situation there, with limited exposure risks - but this virus is a real danger to just about anybody, and so far it just seems to be getting worse. It’s good to hear that you’re recovered enough to be functional again (to a useful extent, anyway), and you’ve probably already been advised not to push yourself harder than your state of recovery permits, so I’d just say that it’s important to put full recovery at the top of the list. Hang in there and concentrate on the stuff that’s possible.
@werehatrack unfortunately we are a one income household and even when I was delirious from fever I was also meditating and praying for a quick recovery because I was counting down the days of PTO in my head of what I had available. I was going over what I have in my savings and what STD would pay, knowing I couldn’t afford FMLA.
All that to say, I know my concern is of my own doing. We just bought a farm and our resources are mostly tapped out because of that. We’re in the re-building stage. I have options, but I hate digging into my options if I have any way of covering things myself… and if that’s pushing myself a bit into recovery, that’s what I do to keep my family fed and housed
@mbersiam @werehatrack
Really hoping you don’t have to miss too much work. And that you can keep your farm projects going without bankruptcy or poverty.
This kinda time is when quality local friends and family can really matter.
(I bet you have some good ones.)
@f00l @mbersiam Me and my family got this mystery illness late 2019 as well, and it lasted about 2-3wks. then one family members got tested and had the antibodies in his system. And yes I do believe it was here in late 2019 before anyone really knew what it was.
@katsuronishi @mbersiam I think early on a number of people had mild enough cases they weren’t hospitalized and no one thought anything of it so missed it was in a pile of states as early as it was. A guy living in this building came back from CA early Jan 2020 (was there 6am weeks with family) and said his CA family was all sick with something, he got sick a few days after coming home, the woman he shacks up with got sick, I then got sick from her. Symptoms consistent with covid (including both the common and less common symptoms). Later in Jan several of his family in CA tested pos as pretty much everyone in his family over the 6 weeks they were together got sick, several hospitalized (those were the ones tested).
They weren’t testing in this state when all of us were sick. We were all told, to a person, that we had atypical viral pneumonia with food poisoning (despite none of us having consumed any food in common and getting sick at different times. Huh?). Of course this was 2.5 months prior to when they said there even was covid in this state and no one was being tested yet here. By the time I was tested for the study I am in it was over a year later I tested neg. Of course my vaccination antibody levels don’t hold out well either due to the blood cancer. Of course none of us will ever know.
@katsuronishi @Kidsandliz @mbersiam I was diagnosed with pneumonia in early Dec 2019, never have had it and it took me out for quite a while. Fortunately didn’t have to go to the hospital or anything. Always wondered if the germs got here way earlier than they knew. @mbersiam I hope you all continue to get better, and that everything goes well with the farm and all – I know that stress of having to worry about medical bills
So sorry you’ve all been sick; I hope you and your husband are fully recovered soon!
I’m actually at the urgent care right now. I got my booster two days ago and my arm is horrible. I almost positive I have cellulitis. Besides the cellulitis I was violently Ill for the past couple of days along with horrible nightmare the first night. The first two vaccines I was completely fine.
Glad to hear you and the fam are feeling better.
@Star2236
After the booster my arm, shoulders, and neck were so sore for more than a week.
Sometimes this still occurs. 2 months later.
I got my booster 2 days ago (all 3 were Moderna), and apart from soreness of the deltoid muscle, it has all been fine for me. I even worked on laying heavy patio stones in my yard… not the smartest thing to do in hindsight, but still no issues (other than a sore back ).
@Star2236 SIL got her booster last week. She had minor reaction to initial 2 covid shots, but the booster had her down with flu-like symptoms for multiple days.
@Star2236 wait, is cellulitis a COVID symptom? I tested positive for covid and was asymptomatic (fully vaxxed) but got what I thought was a COVID related rash that turned out to be cellulitis. Antibiotics cleared it up, was told it was unrelated.
@Star2236 oh no, I hope you feel better soon Sending hugs!
@awkward_pause
No it’s not. I’ve just gotten it really bad from a vaccine before (I’m lucky like that) so that’s why I was being offensive about whatever is going on now. Mine doesn’t look anything like CoVid rash, it looks like I got hit in the arm with some kind of huge ball.
Thanks for sharing your story. Hope you and the family get back to 100 percent very soon and there is minimal impact on your finances. Thankful you were vaccinated because it could have gone a very different way.
/giphy you ok
@medz Thanks for asking. I’m doing ok. I was in the middle of interviewing for two different positions at work and it put a wrench in that. But it also made me think more on which one I really want.
I hope your entire family fully recovers and does so sooner rather than later. That has to have been really hard - especially being the parents of sick kids while you were also sick. Tough to deal with. And hard to keep working when you feel like crap.
It is a good thing you were vaccinated as it sounds like if you weren’t your “break through” cases would have been really, really bad. I am glad you didn’t get it until the monoclonal antibodies were freely available.
So I currently have it (yay). I was vaccinated as soon as I was eligible back in the spring and I got my booster shot last Thursday. I started getting a cough on Sunday so I got tested Monday and it came back positive. Since then it’s been in my sinuses and throat similar to a sinus infection. I just lost my taste/smell yesterday. So far no fever and my vaccinated husband hasn’t has any symptoms. Just trying to ride it out with some Mucinex and ibuprofen for the occasional headache.
@a5meiser Hopefully it doesn’t hit you the way it hit me, make sure to keep up with fluids and take your vitamins, too.
After posting privately on Facebook I had people reaching out to me that they also have it right now and were comparing symptoms.
@mbersiam. So sorry you and your family caught Covid, but glad to hear you guys are on the road to recovery.
I had it last month as well and had many of the same observations as you. I will tell you, at six weeks the fatigue has FINALLY mostly gone (~95%) away and I can mostly smell/taste. It is a long, slow road to full recovery. And like you I had both shots. Since then I also have my booster. Who knows how I caught it, I rarely leave my house anymore.
Here is hoping your recovery is not as long and you and your family remain healthy!
@tinamarie1974 Thank you. The only positive is that now my whole family has natural immunity too.
Here’s my tale of woe…
My son, who was a freshman in college in Nov 2019 (18 years old), comes home for Thanksgiving break, complaining of flu-like symptoms on Sunday before Thanksgiving. Doesn’t improve on Monday, so we scheduled an appointment with his family doctor for Tuesday afternoon.
Tuesday morning, he presents with shortness of breath, dizziness, stabbing chest pain, radiating pain down his left arm and has to be helped to the car for a trip to a local clinic. (We think he has a bad case of flu)
At the clinic… he tests negative for flu. They run an EKG strip, and call an ambulance to send him to the hospital, saying it looks like a heart-attack.
At the hospital… Blood chemistry confirms heart distress. Docs test for everything under the sun… all negative. Say they need to do an angiogram to look at his heart to see why he is presenting with heart-attack symptoms. Angiogram says the heart and all blood vessels are normally formed, he has Myocarditis and Pericarditis. (Swelling of heart muscle and the pericardium, the sac that contains the heart)
After 5 days in the hospital (including Thanksgiving day) he is released. 6 months later, cardiologist says he is completely fine. No lasting effects, he can be released from cardiologist care.
Fast forward to October 2021. He is now a junior in college (20 years old). Needs to be vaccinated as per college mandate. We call his cardiologist, not practicing here anymore. Call the family doctor who researches for a week, and says he can be vaccinated.
He gets Pfizer dose #1 in early November, and experiences a sore arm for 2-3 days.
Gets Pfizer dose #2 a week ago (Thursday). Feels bad Friday, but so did all of us after the second dose. Feels worse Saturday. Starts with stabbing pain in his heart Sunday, and checks into the ER Sunday night.
He gets admitted into the hospital Monday morning with Myocarditis again. After 2 days of treatment, is released feeling OK.
The ER Doctor, and new cardiologist both speculate that, based on his reaction to the second vaccine dose, he had COVID19 in late November 2019, but there were no tests then to confirm that.
Conclusion… Please get vaccinated, so my son won’t have to in the future. He has been told now to never get another COVID vaccine or booster, and who knows what will happen if he gets COVID itself.
Now we’re saving our Christmas gift money until we see the new hospital bill. (2019 was $6000 out-of-pocket after deductibles were satisfied)
@crow Health care in this country is downright antisocial. My 1-hour outpatient surgery for a broken arm cost over $50,000. That’s nearly twice what I used to net per year at that time. Thankfully insurance picked up most of that.
@crow was it put anywhere in his chart that the myocarditis (2nd time) was a result of the covid-19 vaccine? if so, any self-pay amount should be filtered through HRSA for reimbursement and not sent to you. This would all be done on the back end and you wouldn’t see a bill.
@mbersiam I am looking into that over the next few weeks
@crow I’m sorry for you, your son, and your family. However, he should never have gotten the vaccine in the first place, and others getting the vaccine will help nobody but the person who gets the vaccine.
Why are you encouraging others to potentially go through what your son has just gone through?
@crow
@bainst WRONG.
Also - all the people suspicious of vaccines, you probably better not take those monoclonal antibodies either, or that new pill that Pfizer’s developed. Because why would you trust those?
@bainst Those who are vaccinated in the community help my son not to be exposed through mass immunity. I agree, he shouldn’t have taken it. If we’d have been sure he had COVID in 2019, we would have gotten his Dr to get him a waiver. We still don’t know what he had in 2019, we strongly suspect it was COVID, and that suspicion is now backed up by his reaction to the vaccine. The other 4 members of our family are all vaccinated, and had no reactions, other than the standard ‘feeling a little off’ the day after the 2nd dose. I’m not being political… If more healthy people are vaccinated, then compromised people like my son don’t need to risk it. Like I said, we are very worried about how he will fare if he gets COVID again.
@crow That is so scary - I’m glad he is doing better. Agree, we need herd immunity, like with all the other contagious potential killers that we’ve run into in history.
@crow Unfortunately, vaccination for COV-2 does not prevent transmission. See recent news on Gibraltar and other news from the past few weeks regarding transmission within vaccinated populations.
@Kyeh For everyone worried about COVID, if following Kyeh’s logic, you may as well stop driving cars…because you’re much more likely to be in a car accident and die than you are to die of this particular virus.
@bainst Yeah, well - if you DO end up getting a serious case of Covid, please have the decency to stay out of the ICU, and leave the bed open for one of those car crash victims.
Thank u all for sharing your stories, i wish you all the best in your various stages of recovery. With several health conditions that put me at high risk & a moderate case of contamination-focused OCD, it’s been a rough couple of years! I got vaccinated & boosted as soon as I was eligible (just a sore arm each time), but these variants & breakthrough infections really suck. I long for the old days when the vast majority of our fellow citizens gave a crap about public health & appreciated the miraculous scientific breakthroughs, chief among them vaccines, that have greatly expanded our life expectancy. Unfortunately, it’s not as easy to eradicate ignorance as it was smallpox & polio. For anyone still holding out, PLEASE get vaccinated so we can get back to some semblance of normalcy!
Sounds nightmarish! I’m so sorry. I’ve been very paranoid about my son who has underlying conditions…he just got his first shot yesterday . I thought I would feel relief once we were all protected but yeah, apparently not. These breakthrough cases are not always as “mild” as I was led to believe, ugh. Incidentally I also suspect I may have had covid at the end of 2019, I was sick for 6 weeks, talked to health professionals 5 times, couldn’t get a diagnosis, not even a bad one! Oh well. I’ll never know for sure.
Glad to hear that you and your family are feeling better. Being sick like that is the worst, and pretty scary these days. It’s great to have such caring friends and neighbors willing to pitch in help, you guys are actually very lucky. I too remember those awful ice baths and alcohol rub downs from childhood, it’s funny those things that stick with us. I can remember that like it was yesterday, ugh!
Hopefully the worst is behind you and your new adventures with the farm will be nothing but good! I’ll be keeping you in my prayers and sending good vibes!
so, forgive my curiosity, but did you actually get admitted to the hospital, or was that an ER visit or a clinic visit?
Statistically you have a 75% better chance of not getting COVID if vaccinated, and a 90-95 better chance of avoiding being an inpatient.
@chienfou My husband and I both only had a visit to the ER. Husband was borderline admissible. Of the family, I am the only one who was vaccinated. none of us were inpatient.
@mbersiam
Okay. That clears things up some. Glad you’re all doing better… Things locally have been a lot better lately. We haven’t had a covid in-patient in our Hospital in several days
We had it a month ago. Except for my 7 year old, he had it a month prior. Yet the rest of us didn’t catch it then. Weird, I know. None of us are vaccinated. My symptoms were horrible aches, like my bones, especially in my hips. Mild headache. Tired. No fever. No sniffles. Barely a touch of chest gunk. But no urge to cough. Tylenol helped the pain. My husband is a former smoker and over weight, so he had the monoclonal antibodies. My 15 year old had identical symptoms as mine. I never lost taste, but I lost all smell. And I still can’t smell. I was at 100% (other than sense of smell) by a week and a half after onset of symptoms. It really wasn’t bad, I’ve had colds that were way worse.
Did any of you have side effects after your vaccinations and if so were they similar to what you experienced from actual COVID?
@j2 @Star2236
yeah, after the second dose I had symptoms such as fever, sweats, chills overnight. By daybreak I was good to go except for some local tenderness at the injection site. Ditto for the booster I just got about 10 days ago. What that tells me is my immune system is functioning well, and responding as expected.
ER nurse, no COVID (that I know of) fully vaxed and boosted. Exposure risk HIGH. No co-morbidities and generally in good health, almost never get sick with a cold or anything else which is a good thing given my occupation. Local blood bank stopped antibody testing a few months back.
Got my flu shot today…
@j2 I had the weirdest fuckin case of the munchie after the 2nd shot. Took the shot at 5pm, went home and ate dinner, watched some shit online then went to sleep at 11. Woke up at 1am and was famish, ate a little snack but couldn’t fall back to sleep. 3am starving again, ate something, read a novel, 5am again. note: I did not touch the pot.
@j2
Each time I got the shot I felt lightly fluish for a day or two
I didn’t have fever I had extreme sore muscles that lasted much longer than a day or two
I had a feeling of being sick for a day or two
The things that were similar where the headaches and fatigue
Those were very much like the way I felt when I was sick only they dissipated after a couple of days down to about half strength and then very slowly dissipated the rest of the way after that
although sometimes I still get fatigue and headaches like that but they usually only last for half a day or so
sometimes I get them every day in the afternoon for many hours and then after a week or ten days it goes what so perhaps I have mild long term ongoing of whatever I had February 2020
@j2 i felt sluish for a day and had joint pain in my shoulder and elbow for 6 months.
@j2
I was fine with my first two shots, couldn’t even tell I had them. The booster made me extremely sick. Anytime I got up I felt like I was gonna pass out or hurl. Didn’t wanna eat anything but was super thirsty. Finally 3 days later and I feel fine now. I was really, really bad. Almost like being stuck in aura phase of a migraine while having the flu. My arm is still all fucked up.
Urgent care was a complete waste of my time. The cracker ass dr just kept poking my arm making me jump off the table in pain (I was ready to punch him) and read me shit off the internet about the side effects of CoVid vaccines and said “it doesn’t say cellulitis is one of them.” Thanks cracker ass dr, I could have done all that at home.
@j2 @Star2236 Ugh! At times I think the urgent care places get some of the doctors who didn’t pass in the top of their med school classes, the C students…
@mbersiam I’ve been wondering if one would have a similar reaction to actual virus as they do to the vaccination. I’ve had bad reaction to shot #2 and the booster and was hoping that I wouldn’t have a reaction to actual virus but I think I would.
@Kyeh @star2236 THIS IS SO TRUE about the urgent care. You get some rank amateurs. I’ve got chronic migraines so I have a fair amount of experience going to those places LOL. But then once in a while I’ve run across an incredible doctor/nurse practitioner working at a random urgent care (to meet my standards of incredible, you really just have to 1. LISTEN to the patient, stop thinking about your Porsche or your sex doll addiction for a minute), 2. try to figure out the issue, 3. try to fix the problem. My standards are set low cause if you have any kind of chronic health issue, your sanity won’t survive if you set the bar high. I’m not a medical expert, but seems like hell yes you could get cellulitis from a vaccine - it’s a poky thing introducing stuff under the skin, potentially bad things if something isn’t clean. Even if it’s not infected, severe inflammation wouldn’t be that surprising (I think) since the vaccine provokes an immune system response. Those dr’s drive me nuts when I run across them. I am happy you are feeling better
@kerryzero @Kyeh
What do they do for your migraines at the urgent care? I have migraines too, I end up in the er when their real bad for a migraine cocktail and that works but urgent cares here don’t do them.
@kerryzero @Kyeh @Star2236 If urgent care has an MD they are do more than if there are just NP’s or PA’s present at the time. There is a real limit as to what both of them can Rx for pain. Here we have 1 urgent care with one MD there per shift. The particular MD I ran into was competent but has a personality like sandpaper. Likely she wouldn’t be able to hang on to patients in private practice because of that. Under the circumstances I was willing to put up with it.
@Kyeh @Star2236 Usually they didn’t do much – and I usually ended up there too late, when the abortive meds didn’t really work I just went out of desperation. I’ve been lucky lately, I found a neurologist who is very proactive with making sure I’m not getting out of control migraines, and I haven’t had any that require an emergency visit since I started seeing her. She’s flexible with my monthly anti-cgrp injection prescription – if I’m having symptoms and think I need to take it early, she calls it in to make sure I’m covered. I’m lucky to have found someone really willing to try everything to find the right combination of medications. I’m down to an Ajovy injection once a month, and with that on board, Imitrex is stopping any breakthrough migraines 9 times out of 10, and in the other one, it has been a way less severe migraine.
@Kidsandliz @Kyeh @Star2236 It’s so frustrating when you get that doctor and you’re left wondering why on earth this person ever wanted to take a job working with people
@kerryzero @Kyeh @Star2236 Glad you found someone decent who actually takes an interest in making sure what she is doing for you is helpful rather than “by the book”.
@Kyeh @Star2236 I really hope you can find someone like that too, so you don’t have to go to the ER Migraines are horrible, wouldn’t wish them on anyone
@Kidsandliz same for you – I hope you can get an easier solution than having to deal with the ding dongs who don’t help very much
Which vaccine, and how long ago? If it was recent, and the symptoms were so severe, I wonder if it was a bad vaccine batch?
@ShotgunX I was first round Pfizer. I work for a hospital system but am not front line patient care.